37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 1038084 |
Time | |
Date | 201209 |
Local Time Of Day | 0601-1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | LAX.Airport |
State Reference | CA |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Make Model Name | B757-200 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | Descent |
Route In Use | STAR OLDEE ONE |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Component | |
Aircraft Component | FMS/FMC |
Person 1 | |
Function | First Officer Pilot Not Flying |
Qualification | Flight Crew Air Transport Pilot (ATP) |
Events | |
Anomaly | ATC Issue All Types Deviation - Altitude Crossing Restriction Not Met Deviation - Altitude Excursion From Assigned Altitude Deviation - Procedural Published Material / Policy |
Narrative:
We were given multiple route changes from our filed vista two.jli STAR. ATC didn't like our filed route and told us of some letter of agreement between our airline and ATC to do some other STAR when inbound from phx. We advised dispatch to let them know that the filed STAR wasn't something la wanted. Shortly; as I was getting ATIS and gate info and trying to run the checklists; we were cleared to do the oldee one STAR to seavu. Once inbound ATC varied our speeds and altitudes and had us cross laady at 16;000 [vice at or below FL190 at 280 KTS]. Then told us to 'descend; via; the oldee 1 STAR; cleared the 24R ILS after seavu.' as we were double checking the fixes in the FMS reprogramming for the 24R ILS (we had in 25L) and I was doing the PA and interrupted checklist; I missed that the captain started the descent earlier then wyvil (I'm not sure if it was because we were lower then the descent profile to begin with--being at laady at 16;000 and; so; not on the 'programmed' VNAV path--or if the VNAV guidance 'fell out' of VNAV path. I do know the captain had the correct info executed in the FMS and had pushed VNAV.) we were told to stop our descent somewhere around 15;000 ft when we were past laady and; perhaps; past wyvil. We ended up at 14;500 ft between wyvil and oldee! I then queried ATC if they wanted us to continue the descent to cross 14;000 at oldee? They then cleared us off the STAR and gave us direct to a fix on the ILS and gave us step down alt. ATC said we were not supposed to descend below 16;000 until past wyvil; to which I didn't respond to because I wasn't sure if they were going to violate us or not. We had an inadvertent altitude deviation caused by too many changes in a high workload environment. I had not had much sleep the night before when scheduling called early for a less than two hour show. We pushed a few hours later and I was not on top of all the ATC changes that they were throwing at us. I should have done ATIS; gate ACARS; PA and checklists much sooner and been ready for many ATC changes in lax as I've been here before and know they like to mess with us; but I was a bit slow that morning. Both the captain and I double checked the FMS inputs and they were correct; but I didn't monitor the VNAV path as I should have because of trying to do too much at once. I believe ATC should not clear us to descend via a star unless they are going to keep us on it as published--especially when we are already off profile to begin with. We did four legs that day and none of the published SID's and STAR's we were followed by ATC. I also recommend that we should do the PA and get gate info earlier then our 18;000 ft SOP as that is often when things go wrong.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A B757-200 flight crew; cleared via the OLDEE STAR to LAX was confused by disruptions to the published procedure and descended prematurely prior to a crossing restriction. Fatigue and frequent ATC deviations from published terminal procedures were cited as contributing factors.
Narrative: We were given multiple route changes from our filed VISTA TWO.JLI STAR. ATC didn't like our filed route and told us of some letter of agreement between our airline and ATC to do some other STAR when inbound from PHX. We advised Dispatch to let them know that the filed STAR wasn't something LA wanted. Shortly; as I was getting ATIS and gate info and trying to run the checklists; we were cleared to do the OLDEE ONE STAR to SEAVU. Once inbound ATC varied our speeds and altitudes and had us cross LAADY at 16;000 [vice at or below FL190 at 280 KTS]. Then told us to 'descend; via; the OLDEE 1 STAR; cleared the 24R ILS after SEAVU.' As we were double checking the fixes in the FMS reprogramming for the 24R ILS (we had in 25L) and I was doing the PA and interrupted checklist; I missed that the Captain started the descent earlier then WYVIL (I'm not sure if it was because we were lower then the descent profile to begin with--being at LAADY at 16;000 and; so; not on the 'programmed' VNAV PATH--or if the VNAV guidance 'fell out' of VNAV PATH. I do know the Captain had the correct info executed in the FMS and had pushed VNAV.) We were told to stop our descent somewhere around 15;000 FT when we were past LAADY and; perhaps; past WYVIL. We ended up at 14;500 FT between WYVIL and OLDEE! I then queried ATC if they wanted us to continue the descent to cross 14;000 at OLDEE? They then cleared us off the STAR and gave us direct to a fix on the ILS and gave us step down alt. ATC said we were not supposed to descend below 16;000 until past WYVIL; to which I didn't respond to because I wasn't sure if they were going to violate us or not. We had an inadvertent altitude deviation caused by too many changes in a high workload environment. I had not had much sleep the night before when Scheduling called early for a less than two hour show. We pushed a few hours later and I was not on top of all the ATC changes that they were throwing at us. I should have done ATIS; gate ACARS; PA and Checklists much sooner and been ready for many ATC changes in LAX as I've been here before and know they like to mess with us; but I was a bit slow that morning. Both the Captain and I double checked the FMS inputs and they were correct; but I didn't monitor the VNAV path as I should have because of trying to do too much at once. I believe ATC should not clear us to descend via a star unless they are going to keep us on it as published--especially when we are already off profile to begin with. We did four legs that day and none of the published SID's and STAR's we were followed by ATC. I also recommend that we should do the PA and get gate info earlier then our 18;000 FT SOP as that is often when things go wrong.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2013 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.