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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 109541 |
Time | |
Date | 198904 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : roc |
State Reference | NY |
Altitude | agl bound lower : 0 agl bound upper : 0 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport |
Flight Phase | ground : holding ground other : taxi |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : atp pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 90 flight time total : 8000 flight time type : 40 |
ASRS Report | 109541 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Events | |
Anomaly | incursion : runway non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : exited adverse environment other |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation other |
Situations | |
Airport | other physical facility |
Narrative:
While acting as PIC of flight, roc to lga, we received a clearance to taxi from our gate to runway 22 via delta taxiway. The plate depicts taxiway delta as running north and south. However, part of what appears to be and is marked taxiway delta extends beyond the end of runway 4, and continues parallel to runway 4. This part of the taxiway is not clearly depicted on the plate. This part of the taxiway continues beyond the end of runway 4 approximately 400'. When we encountered the first taxiway delta sign we were taxiing west we observed a hold line and an ILS sign. I asked the first officer if we needed to hold at this north line, since I was just slightly familiar with the airport and saw no intervening taxiway on my plate. Also, he had been to this particular airport on numerous occasions and I wanted to solicit his knowledge. (He had served as an FAA inspector before gaining employment with our airline.) he pointed to a hold line farther south near the entrance to runway 22 and stated that the southern line was the hold line for our purposes. I could not see any other hold lines so I turned south on the taxiway, crossing the hold line. When I arrived at the southern hold line I found we had positioned the aircraft on the west side of the southern hold line near the entrance to runway 22 and under the approach path of aircraft inbound on the ILS to runway 22. The placement of a simple ILS sign and a hold line in this area confused us because we were not clear on the meaning of this sign and markings. Ground control alerted us to the situation and stated that for future reference we should observe the north hold line. What prompted me to write this report was an inbound airliner crossed over us on approach to runway 22. We were in no danger, but on an IMC day, out of tower view, it is conceivable to me that an aircraft strobe light could be mistaken to be an approach light, placing the aircraft in flight and on the ground in a perilous position. As a new captain (and flight instrument) I must say I have never encountered taxiway markings such as these. The plate shows the ramp area and delta taxiway as protruding underneath the approach to runway 22, but does not show this parallel taxiway beyond the end of runway 4. We could have stopped the aircraft to question our concerns, but I trusted the observation of the first officer for he seemed knowledgeable about this area. In the future I will confirm for myself any doubts I may have re: such a situation, although I must say I have never seen taxiway markings such as these. I believe a note on the plate and a sign at the hold line (north) would prevent any ambiguities.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: RWY HOLD LINE TRANSGRESSION. POSSIBLE INTRUSION INTO APCH AREA OF ACTIVE RWY.
Narrative: WHILE ACTING AS PIC OF FLT, ROC TO LGA, WE RECEIVED A CLRNC TO TAXI FROM OUR GATE TO RWY 22 VIA DELTA TXWY. THE PLATE DEPICTS TXWY DELTA AS RUNNING N AND S. HOWEVER, PART OF WHAT APPEARS TO BE AND IS MARKED TXWY DELTA EXTENDS BEYOND THE END OF RWY 4, AND CONTINUES PARALLEL TO RWY 4. THIS PART OF THE TXWY IS NOT CLEARLY DEPICTED ON THE PLATE. THIS PART OF THE TXWY CONTINUES BEYOND THE END OF RWY 4 APPROX 400'. WHEN WE ENCOUNTERED THE FIRST TXWY DELTA SIGN WE WERE TAXIING W WE OBSERVED A HOLD LINE AND AN ILS SIGN. I ASKED THE F/O IF WE NEEDED TO HOLD AT THIS N LINE, SINCE I WAS JUST SLIGHTLY FAMILIAR WITH THE ARPT AND SAW NO INTERVENING TXWY ON MY PLATE. ALSO, HE HAD BEEN TO THIS PARTICULAR ARPT ON NUMEROUS OCCASIONS AND I WANTED TO SOLICIT HIS KNOWLEDGE. (HE HAD SERVED AS AN FAA INSPECTOR BEFORE GAINING EMPLOYMENT WITH OUR AIRLINE.) HE POINTED TO A HOLD LINE FARTHER S NEAR THE ENTRANCE TO RWY 22 AND STATED THAT THE SOUTHERN LINE WAS THE HOLD LINE FOR OUR PURPOSES. I COULD NOT SEE ANY OTHER HOLD LINES SO I TURNED S ON THE TXWY, XING THE HOLD LINE. WHEN I ARRIVED AT THE SOUTHERN HOLD LINE I FOUND WE HAD POSITIONED THE ACFT ON THE W SIDE OF THE SOUTHERN HOLD LINE NEAR THE ENTRANCE TO RWY 22 AND UNDER THE APCH PATH OF ACFT INBND ON THE ILS TO RWY 22. THE PLACEMENT OF A SIMPLE ILS SIGN AND A HOLD LINE IN THIS AREA CONFUSED US BECAUSE WE WERE NOT CLEAR ON THE MEANING OF THIS SIGN AND MARKINGS. GND CTL ALERTED US TO THE SITUATION AND STATED THAT FOR FUTURE REF WE SHOULD OBSERVE THE N HOLD LINE. WHAT PROMPTED ME TO WRITE THIS RPT WAS AN INBND AIRLINER CROSSED OVER US ON APCH TO RWY 22. WE WERE IN NO DANGER, BUT ON AN IMC DAY, OUT OF TWR VIEW, IT IS CONCEIVABLE TO ME THAT AN ACFT STROBE LIGHT COULD BE MISTAKEN TO BE AN APCH LIGHT, PLACING THE ACFT IN FLT AND ON THE GND IN A PERILOUS POS. AS A NEW CAPT (AND FLT INSTR) I MUST SAY I HAVE NEVER ENCOUNTERED TXWY MARKINGS SUCH AS THESE. THE PLATE SHOWS THE RAMP AREA AND DELTA TXWY AS PROTRUDING UNDERNEATH THE APCH TO RWY 22, BUT DOES NOT SHOW THIS PARALLEL TXWY BEYOND THE END OF RWY 4. WE COULD HAVE STOPPED THE ACFT TO QUESTION OUR CONCERNS, BUT I TRUSTED THE OBSERVATION OF THE F/O FOR HE SEEMED KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT THIS AREA. IN THE FUTURE I WILL CONFIRM FOR MYSELF ANY DOUBTS I MAY HAVE RE: SUCH A SITUATION, ALTHOUGH I MUST SAY I HAVE NEVER SEEN TXWY MARKINGS SUCH AS THESE. I BELIEVE A NOTE ON THE PLATE AND A SIGN AT THE HOLD LINE (N) WOULD PREVENT ANY AMBIGUITIES.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.