Flight crew of large transport in cruise at FL390 vectored around thunderstorm buildups by ZLC.

Attributes
ACN	119419
Time
Date	198908
Day	Thu
Local Time Of Day	1801 To 2400
Place
Locale Reference	atc facility : oal
State Reference	NV
Altitude	msl bound lower : 39000 msl bound upper : 39000
Environment
Flight Conditions	Mixed
Light	Dusk
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	artcc : zlc
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Large Transport, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng
Flight Phase	cruise other
Route In Use	enroute : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp pilot : flight engineer
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 100 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 95
ASRS Report	119419
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : first officer
Qualification	pilot : instrument pilot : flight engineer pilot : commercial
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 100 flight time total : 2500 flight time type : 700
Events
Anomaly	inflight encounter : weather
Independent Detector	other controllera other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	none taken : anomaly accepted
Consequence	Other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	Weather
Air Traffic Incident	other

Narrative:

A severe WX warning had been issued for the area we were approaching for utah, nevada, arizona. ZLC cleared us direct from ilc to oal VOR. As we approached oal we had a large thunderstorm at our 12 O'clock position with the line extending to the north and west. We requested to turn left 10 degree to deviate around the cell at our 12 O'clock position. We were given permission by ZLC. As we approached the cell about 15 mi from it center said that we must fly a heading that would have taken us directly into the cell and we must turn in 5 mi. I told him that we could not turn right but could go left. At the time he informed us that we would have to make a 180 degree turn, which we did. As soon as we had completed the 180 degree turn, center said that we could make a right 180 degree turn and proceed direct to oal again. We did make the turn and again as we approached the same cell we were told that we would have to turn again to a heading that would take us directly into the cell. Before we had made this turn I had asked the controller if the range was now cold because I knew that the track to oal would take us near restr area. The controller said that he was now in contact with nellis. As we approached the cell the second time and the controller tried to turn us into the cell, I told him that we could turn to 360 degree at that time and 270 in 5 more miles. Air traffic controller should not direct aircraft with such a close tolerance that only a 5 NM buffer exists between aircraft, WX, and the restr area. Also, more and timely planning by the controller is needed to keep aircraft from getting into areas where ATC cannot properly direct and control them.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: FLT CREW OF LGT IN CRUISE AT FL390 VECTORED AROUND TSTM BUILDUPS BY ZLC.

Narrative: A SEVERE WX WARNING HAD BEEN ISSUED FOR THE AREA WE WERE APCHING FOR UTAH, NEVADA, ARIZONA. ZLC CLRED US DIRECT FROM ILC TO OAL VOR. AS WE APCHED OAL WE HAD A LARGE TSTM AT OUR 12 O'CLOCK POSITION WITH THE LINE EXTENDING TO THE N AND W. WE REQUESTED TO TURN LEFT 10 DEG TO DEVIATE AROUND THE CELL AT OUR 12 O'CLOCK POSITION. WE WERE GIVEN PERMISSION BY ZLC. AS WE APCHED THE CELL ABOUT 15 MI FROM IT CENTER SAID THAT WE MUST FLY A HDG THAT WOULD HAVE TAKEN US DIRECTLY INTO THE CELL AND WE MUST TURN IN 5 MI. I TOLD HIM THAT WE COULD NOT TURN RIGHT BUT COULD GO LEFT. AT THE TIME HE INFORMED US THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO MAKE A 180 DEG TURN, WHICH WE DID. AS SOON AS WE HAD COMPLETED THE 180 DEG TURN, CENTER SAID THAT WE COULD MAKE A RIGHT 180 DEG TURN AND PROCEED DIRECT TO OAL AGAIN. WE DID MAKE THE TURN AND AGAIN AS WE APCHED THE SAME CELL WE WERE TOLD THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO TURN AGAIN TO A HDG THAT WOULD TAKE US DIRECTLY INTO THE CELL. BEFORE WE HAD MADE THIS TURN I HAD ASKED THE CTLR IF THE RANGE WAS NOW COLD BECAUSE I KNEW THAT THE TRACK TO OAL WOULD TAKE US NEAR RESTR AREA. THE CTLR SAID THAT HE WAS NOW IN CONTACT WITH NELLIS. AS WE APCHED THE CELL THE SECOND TIME AND THE CTLR TRIED TO TURN US INTO THE CELL, I TOLD HIM THAT WE COULD TURN TO 360 DEG AT THAT TIME AND 270 IN 5 MORE MILES. AIR TFC CTLR SHOULD NOT DIRECT ACFT WITH SUCH A CLOSE TOLERANCE THAT ONLY A 5 NM BUFFER EXISTS BETWEEN ACFT, WX, AND THE RESTR AREA. ALSO, MORE AND TIMELY PLANNING BY THE CTLR IS NEEDED TO KEEP ACFT FROM GETTING INTO AREAS WHERE ATC CANNOT PROPERLY DIRECT AND CONTROL THEM.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.