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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 129498 |
Time | |
Date | 198911 |
Day | Mon |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : lax |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 2500 msl bound upper : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : lax |
Operator | common carrier : air taxi |
Make Model Name | Light Transport |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air taxi |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 260 flight time total : 6000 |
ASRS Report | 129498 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air taxi |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : commercial |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 1500 vertical : 500 |
Supplementary | |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
As PIC of light transport X on right downwind at 5000 MSL over the smo VORTAC I had received an ATC instruction to advise when an medium large transport Y was in sight turning right base 3 miles ahead of us for the runway 24 complex (north side). I made visual contact with medium large transport Y in the base turn and so advised approach control. We were then cleared for the visual for wry 25L (south complex) and to make the base turn over the top of medium large transport Y not to descend below 2000' until advised by tower. I commenced the right base turn at 5000 MSL and started descending to 2000 MSL with medium large transport Y in sight through the entire turn. My separation from medium large transport Y as we crossed over its approach path was about 500' vertical and about 1500' horizontal. While turning from base to final I contacted lax tower and we were cleared to land. No evasive action was taken on my part and I had complied with all ATC instructions and had maintained required VFR separation as specified in the ATC handbook 7110.65 and the aim. I did not feel this incident was a true near miss, however it is my understanding that the medium large transport Y captain did file a near miss report and so I thought it be best to file this report for the record. This visual approach procedure is commonly used at lax whereby aircraft downwind north are vectored over the 'top' of aircraft on final for the 24 runways, then once past the approach path, continue the descent for the final turn to the 25 runways on the south complex. This maneuver can be accomplished safely provided, the flight crew is familiar with the airport and its arrivals and visibility is greater than MVFR (3-5 SM).
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: LTT ON VISUAL APCH TO LAX CROSSES 500' VERTICALLY FROM MLG TRAFFIC ALSO ON VISUAL APCH, BUT TO DIFFERENT RWY.
Narrative: AS PIC OF LTT X ON RIGHT DOWNWIND AT 5000 MSL OVER THE SMO VORTAC I HAD RECEIVED AN ATC INSTRUCTION TO ADVISE WHEN AN MLG Y WAS IN SIGHT TURNING RIGHT BASE 3 MILES AHEAD OF US FOR THE RWY 24 COMPLEX (N SIDE). I MADE VISUAL CONTACT WITH MLG Y IN THE BASE TURN AND SO ADVISED APCH CTL. WE WERE THEN CLRED FOR THE VISUAL FOR WRY 25L (S COMPLEX) AND TO MAKE THE BASE TURN OVER THE TOP OF MLG Y NOT TO DSND BELOW 2000' UNTIL ADVISED BY TWR. I COMMENCED THE RIGHT BASE TURN AT 5000 MSL AND STARTED DESCENDING TO 2000 MSL WITH MLG Y IN SIGHT THROUGH THE ENTIRE TURN. MY SEPARATION FROM MLG Y AS WE CROSSED OVER ITS APCH PATH WAS ABOUT 500' VERTICAL AND ABOUT 1500' HORIZ. WHILE TURNING FROM BASE TO FINAL I CONTACTED LAX TWR AND WE WERE CLRED TO LAND. NO EVASIVE ACTION WAS TAKEN ON MY PART AND I HAD COMPLIED WITH ALL ATC INSTRUCTIONS AND HAD MAINTAINED REQUIRED VFR SEPARATION AS SPECIFIED IN THE ATC HANDBOOK 7110.65 AND THE AIM. I DID NOT FEEL THIS INCIDENT WAS A TRUE NEAR MISS, HOWEVER IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE MLG Y CAPT DID FILE A NEAR MISS REPORT AND SO I THOUGHT IT BE BEST TO FILE THIS REPORT FOR THE RECORD. THIS VISUAL APCH PROC IS COMMONLY USED AT LAX WHEREBY ACFT DOWNWIND NORTH ARE VECTORED OVER THE 'TOP' OF ACFT ON FINAL FOR THE 24 RWYS, THEN ONCE PAST THE APCH PATH, CONTINUE THE DSCNT FOR THE FINAL TURN TO THE 25 RWYS ON THE SOUTH COMPLEX. THIS MANEUVER CAN BE ACCOMPLISHED SAFELY PROVIDED, THE FLT CREW IS FAMILIAR WITH THE ARPT AND ITS ARRIVALS AND VISIBILITY IS GREATER THAN MVFR (3-5 SM).
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.