37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 1326926 |
Time | |
Date | 201601 |
Local Time Of Day | 1801-2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | D10.TRACON |
State Reference | TX |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | Descent |
Route In Use | STAR JOVEM 2 |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | Climb |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Function | Instructor Approach |
Qualification | Air Traffic Control Fully Certified |
Experience | Air Traffic Control Time Certified In Pos 1 (yrs) 5.5 |
Person 2 | |
Function | First Officer Pilot Not Flying |
Qualification | Flight Crew Air Transport Pilot (ATP) |
Events | |
Anomaly | ATC Issue All Types Conflict Airborne Conflict Deviation - Altitude Excursion From Assigned Altitude Deviation - Procedural Published Material / Policy Deviation - Procedural Clearance |
Narrative:
I was training a cpc (certified professional controller). Aircraft X was issued to descend via the STAR. The STAR level off altitude is 11;000 feet. When I caught they had descended early; they were leaving 7;800 feet. We gave them an immediate descend to 6;000 feet to miss a dfw departure. Aircraft X came within 1;000 feet and 3 miles of aircraft Y; a dfw departure who was climbing out on the SID. Aircraft X informed us he was issued to descend via the STAR except maintain 6;000 feet from the last controller (ZFW - ukw sector). We issued them descend via the STAR at least twice in initial contact. That clearance from us should have deleted any previous descend via clearance. ZFW (ukw sector) was issuing all of our arrivals amended descend via clearance to make their sequence work. Changing aircraft instructions will mess with the aircraft's FMS. Pilots need to check and recheck their FMS's when [given] different instructions off the STAR. ZFW arrival sector controllers need retraining on how their instructions affect the aircraft flight plan. The ZFW arrival sectors (especially ukw sector) constantly change aircraft speed and or altitudes from what is published on the STAR's. They never coordinate these changes with us. Making those changes need to be coordinated per our LOA. The feeder controllers are working twice as hard to verify the aircraft are doing what we expect (STAR); and it's putting too much workload on us.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: Air carrier flight crew and Controller reported of confusion related to Descend Via clearance. Controller issued descend via the JOVEM2 STAR at least twice. Pilot had received from previous Controller descend via the STAR except maintain 6;000 feet. Controller thought the last clearance he issued was the one the pilot should have done. Pilots were confused and did not do what the last instruction from ATC was.
Narrative: I was training a CPC (Certified Professional Controller). Aircraft X was issued to descend via the STAR. The STAR level off altitude is 11;000 feet. When I caught they had descended early; they were leaving 7;800 feet. We gave them an immediate descend to 6;000 feet to miss a DFW departure. Aircraft X came within 1;000 feet and 3 miles of Aircraft Y; a DFW departure who was climbing out on the SID. Aircraft X informed us he was issued to descend via the STAR except maintain 6;000 feet from the last controller (ZFW - UKW sector). We issued them descend via the STAR at least twice in initial contact. That clearance from us should have deleted any previous descend via clearance. ZFW (UKW sector) was issuing all of our arrivals amended descend via clearance to make their sequence work. Changing aircraft instructions will mess with the aircraft's FMS. Pilots need to check and recheck their FMS's when [given] different instructions off the STAR. ZFW arrival sector controllers need retraining on how their instructions affect the aircraft flight plan. The ZFW arrival sectors (especially UKW sector) constantly change aircraft speed and or altitudes from what is published on the STAR's. They never coordinate these changes with us. Making those changes need to be coordinated per our LOA. The Feeder controllers are working twice as hard to verify the aircraft are doing what we expect (STAR); and it's putting too much workload on us.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.