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A center and tower controller disagreed whether an aircraft with an IFR clearance including an initial VFR leg could be released with simultaneous IFR arrivals. The tower departed the aircraft with an aircraft on approach.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 1336917 |
| Time | |
| Date | 201603 |
| Local Time Of Day | 1801-2400 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | HCF.TRACON |
| State Reference | HI |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Make Model Name | Small Transport |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
| Flight Phase | Taxi |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Function | Approach Enroute |
| Qualification | Air Traffic Control Fully Certified |
| Experience | Air Traffic Control Time Certified In Pos 1 (yrs) 23 |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | ATC Issue All Types Deviation - Procedural Clearance Deviation - Procedural Published Material / Policy |
Narrative:
Aircraft X was on approach to the airport. He later called the airport in sight for a visual approach; which I gave him. At some time before or after that; tower called and asked for a clearance from the ground for aircraft Y; VFR to an intersection; then to [destination] airport. I tried to give him a clearance from over the intersection; but he wanted a clearance from the ground. I told the tower controller that I was unable to issue a clearance from the ground; as I had inbound IFR aircraft. He said no; VFR to the intersection; and I again stated that I could not issue the clearance; whether or not it was an instrument departure procedure (idp) or VFR conditions to the intersection; as both clearances start at the airport; and require IFR separation. I told him they can wait on the ground until the aircraft on approach arrives; or get his clearance from over the intersection.the clearance he got was from over the intersection. I waited until I got the call of the arrival of the first of my two aircrafts; aircraft X; then I cleared aircraft Z for the approach. As aircraft Z was maybe 15 miles northwest of the airport; aircraft Y popped up on radar; and after taking radar; I called traffic between the two aircraft.some people think this is not a problem in our facility; and this situation was covered in an interpretation binder; but that binder was removed from the floor years ago; and out staff and management fail to issue any direction on this matter. To me this is not a VFR climb on course; where you can climb through another IFR aircraft; and being on a VFR flight plan is different from being on an IFR flight plan; whether or not you are in VFR (or VMC) conditions or IFR conditions. One is about protecting IFR aircraft from other IFR aircraft; and the other is VFR vs IFR flying conditions; i.e. The weather!whether the aircraft choses or is issued the instrument departure procedure; or gets to the intersection; where his routing starts; matters not; if he has a clearance from the ground; he is IFR; from the ground!
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A Center and Tower Controller disagreed whether an aircraft with an IFR clearance including an initial VFR leg could be released with simultaneous IFR arrivals. The Tower departed the aircraft with an aircraft on approach.
Narrative: Aircraft X was on approach to the airport. He later called the airport in sight for a visual approach; which I gave him. At some time before or after that; Tower called and asked for a clearance from the ground for Aircraft Y; VFR to an intersection; then to [destination] airport. I tried to give him a clearance from over the intersection; but he wanted a clearance from the ground. I told the Tower Controller that I was unable to issue a clearance from the ground; as I had inbound IFR aircraft. He said no; VFR to the intersection; and I again stated that I could not issue the clearance; whether or not it was an Instrument Departure Procedure (IDP) or VFR conditions to the intersection; as both clearances start at the airport; and require IFR separation. I told him they can wait on the ground until the aircraft on approach arrives; or get his clearance from over the intersection.The clearance he got was from over the intersection. I waited until I got the call of the arrival of the first of my two aircrafts; Aircraft X; then I cleared Aircraft Z for the approach. As Aircraft Z was maybe 15 miles northwest of the airport; Aircraft Y popped up on radar; and after taking radar; I called traffic between the two aircraft.Some people think this is not a problem in our facility; and this situation was covered in an interpretation binder; but that binder was removed from the floor years ago; and out staff and management fail to issue any direction on this matter. To me this is not a VFR climb on course; where you can climb through another IFR aircraft; and being on a VFR flight plan is different from being on an IFR flight plan; whether or not you are in VFR (OR VMC) conditions or IFR conditions. One is about protecting IFR aircraft from other IFR aircraft; and the other is VFR VS IFR flying conditions; i.e. the weather!Whether the aircraft choses or is issued the instrument departure procedure; or gets to the intersection; where his routing starts; matters not; if he has a clearance from the ground; he is IFR; from the ground!
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.