Narrative:

I pre-filed an IFR flight plan from knb. I elected not to pick up my clearance on the ground because the overcast ceiling was about 3000-4000 AGL; and I knew that I could contact ZLA in the air by radio (having just been in contact with them when I landed at knb half an hour before). I generally prefer to pick up my clearance by radio when I can; rather than using the national delivery phone number; because it is more time efficient. I contacted ZLA by radio while maintaining VFR in VMC below the cloud layer; and requested my IFR clearance. I was cleared as follows: 'upon reaching one zero thousand; cleared to ZZZ airport via...; climb and maintain...' I read back the clearance without the 'upon reaching part' and was reminded by the controller that 'all that was upon reaching one zero thousand.' I accepted the clearance; climbed on my then present heading through the cloud layer that was between about 8;000 and 10;000; and upon reaching 10;000 proceeded direct to my next clearance fix. My aircraft is equipped with terrain awareness capability (G500 mfd); so I was completely comfortable with the safety of my behavior. During my arrival into knb and again during the time of this story; I heard ZLA issue similar clearances to at least two other aircraft who were also picking up their IFR clearances in the air. All the other aircraft did exactly the same thing that I did - i.e. They accepted the clearance; including the 'upon reaching' part - and then proceeded into IMC below the altitude specified in the 'upon reaching' limit. I assume that this behavior is commonplace - i.e. Aircraft receive an IFR clearance that includes an altitude limit (which limit I assume is related to the MVA in the area); and then proceed into IMC below that altitude. I am not certain of the legality of this behavior. It would seem to me that I entered IMC conditions before my IFR clearance was valid. And yet there can be no question that that was exactly what the controller expected me to do - or that it was what other aircraft in the area were doing.my point in filing this report is that this type of clearance seems; on its face; problematic. To issue a clearance that is not valid until an aircraft climbs above a cloud layer is to put the pilot into an impossible situation - either proceed VFR until able to climb in VFR conditions (which on this particular day would have required me to fly for tens of miles at least under the cloud layer) or essentially ignore the altitude restriction (as everyone else seemed to be doing) and enter IMC while not technically on a valid instrument clearance. I suggest that ZLA modify its practices to issue clearances that allow for pilots to climb through IMC to the MVA i.e. The controller could specify that the pilot must maintain their own terrain and obstacle clearance until reaching one zero thousand). I have received such IFR clearances from other facilities in the past; and found them useful and constructive.

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: GA pilot reported he picked up an IFR clearance in the air from ZLA which stated 'upon reaching one zero thousand; cleared to destination.' Pilot reported he climbed through a cloud layer to reach his cruise altitude and questioned the legality of this behavior.

Narrative: I pre-filed an IFR flight plan from KNB. I elected not to pick up my clearance on the ground because the overcast ceiling was about 3000-4000 AGL; and I knew that I could contact ZLA in the air by radio (having just been in contact with them when I landed at KNB half an hour before). I generally prefer to pick up my clearance by radio when I can; rather than using the national delivery phone number; because it is more time efficient. I contacted ZLA by radio while maintaining VFR in VMC below the cloud layer; and requested my IFR clearance. I was cleared as follows: 'Upon reaching one zero thousand; cleared to ZZZ Airport via...; climb and maintain...' I read back the clearance without the 'upon reaching part' and was reminded by the controller that 'all that was upon reaching one zero thousand.' I accepted the clearance; climbed on my then present heading through the cloud layer that was between about 8;000 and 10;000; and upon reaching 10;000 proceeded direct to my next clearance fix. My aircraft is equipped with terrain awareness capability (G500 MFD); so I was completely comfortable with the safety of my behavior. During my arrival into KNB and again during the time of this story; I heard ZLA issue similar clearances to at least two other aircraft who were also picking up their IFR clearances in the air. All the other aircraft did exactly the same thing that I did - i.e. they accepted the clearance; including the 'upon reaching' part - and then proceeded into IMC below the altitude specified in the 'upon reaching' limit. I assume that this behavior is commonplace - i.e. aircraft receive an IFR clearance that includes an altitude limit (which limit I assume is related to the MVA in the area); and then proceed into IMC below that altitude. I am not certain of the legality of this behavior. It would seem to me that I entered IMC conditions before my IFR clearance was valid. And yet there can be no question that that was exactly what the controller expected me to do - or that it was what other aircraft in the area were doing.My point in filing this report is that this type of clearance seems; on its face; problematic. To issue a clearance that is not valid until an aircraft climbs above a cloud layer is to put the pilot into an impossible situation - either proceed VFR until able to climb in VFR conditions (which on this particular day would have required me to fly for tens of miles at least under the cloud layer) or essentially ignore the altitude restriction (as everyone else seemed to be doing) and enter IMC while not technically on a valid instrument clearance. I suggest that ZLA modify its practices to issue clearances that allow for pilots to climb through IMC to the MVA i.e. the controller could specify that the pilot must maintain their own terrain and obstacle clearance until reaching one zero thousand). I have received such IFR clearances from other facilities in the past; and found them useful and constructive.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.