37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 194784 |
Time | |
Date | 199111 |
Day | Tue |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : lga |
State Reference | NY |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 5000 msl bound upper : 5000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : n90 tower : stl |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Light Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Flight Phase | cruise other |
Route In Use | departure other enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : atp pilot : instrument |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 300 flight time total : 6800 flight time type : 3000 |
ASRS Report | 194787 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : commercial |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : clearance other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted other |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Ny departure amended our SID when we checked in -- fly a 90 degree heading in lieu of a 40 degree heading. We maintained our initially assigned altitude and heading 090 degree. Several mins later ny called, 'flight xxy turn left 270.' we were flight XXX so I called to confirm instructions were for XXX. Ny answered, 'XXX turn left 270 degree.' I was uneasy with instructions for a 180 degree course reversal, back into the departure flow of traffic from ny so I again queried the 180 degree course reversal. Ny would not answer and continued talking to other aircraft on the frequency. I was very frustrated as I consider instructions for a complete course reversal extremely rare but I am not in the habit of ignoring ATC instructions. Finally after 3-4 calls, ny answered, 'XXX, left 270 degree now!' between 30 seconds and a min were wasted. Owing to the very unusual instructions I think ny should have followed up on my request for a clarification immediately. It is very unfair of a controller to blurt out an oddball instruction and then ignore repeated pilot requests for clarification. These sort of situations lead to accidents. I admit that ATC instructions are to be followed immediately but my considerable experience operating in this airspace gave me reason for doubt.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLT DEPARTING LGA ON 90 DEG HDG CLRED BY DEP CTLR TURN TO 270 DEGS. CAPT DID NOT START TURN UNTIL HE OBTAINED CONFIRMATION OF COURSE REVERSAL.
Narrative: NY DEP AMENDED OUR SID WHEN WE CHKED IN -- FLY A 90 DEG HDG IN LIEU OF A 40 DEG HDG. WE MAINTAINED OUR INITIALLY ASSIGNED ALT AND HDG 090 DEG. SEVERAL MINS LATER NY CALLED, 'FLT XXY TURN L 270.' WE WERE FLT XXX SO I CALLED TO CONFIRM INSTRUCTIONS WERE FOR XXX. NY ANSWERED, 'XXX TURN L 270 DEG.' I WAS UNEASY WITH INSTRUCTIONS FOR A 180 DEG COURSE REVERSAL, BACK INTO THE DEP FLOW OF TFC FROM NY SO I AGAIN QUERIED THE 180 DEG COURSE REVERSAL. NY WOULD NOT ANSWER AND CONTINUED TALKING TO OTHER ACFT ON THE FREQ. I WAS VERY FRUSTRATED AS I CONSIDER INSTRUCTIONS FOR A COMPLETE COURSE REVERSAL EXTREMELY RARE BUT I AM NOT IN THE HABIT OF IGNORING ATC INSTRUCTIONS. FINALLY AFTER 3-4 CALLS, NY ANSWERED, 'XXX, L 270 DEG NOW!' BTWN 30 SECONDS AND A MIN WERE WASTED. OWING TO THE VERY UNUSUAL INSTRUCTIONS I THINK NY SHOULD HAVE FOLLOWED UP ON MY REQUEST FOR A CLARIFICATION IMMEDIATELY. IT IS VERY UNFAIR OF A CTLR TO BLURT OUT AN ODDBALL INSTRUCTION AND THEN IGNORE REPEATED PLT REQUESTS FOR CLARIFICATION. THESE SORT OF SITUATIONS LEAD TO ACCIDENTS. I ADMIT THAT ATC INSTRUCTIONS ARE TO BE FOLLOWED IMMEDIATELY BUT MY CONSIDERABLE EXPERIENCE OPERATING IN THIS AIRSPACE GAVE ME REASON FOR DOUBT.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.