37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 199343 |
Time | |
Date | 199201 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : kin |
State Reference | FO |
Altitude | agl bound lower : 0 agl bound upper : 200 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : kin |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Widebody, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | climbout : initial climbout : intermediate altitude climbout : takeoff |
Route In Use | departure sid : sid |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 180 flight time total : 20000 flight time type : 2000 |
ASRS Report | 199343 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : clearance non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted none taken : detected after the fact |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Situations | |
Airport | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
We had been cleared by kingston for the kingston 2 departure off runway 12 en route to jfk. Approaching the end of the taxiway we were cleared for takeoff. WX was clear and visibility unlimited. As we were starting the takeoff roll the tower asked if we could cross the kingston VOR at 9000 ft, at least that is what I understood him to say. Well into the takeoff roll he came back with another clearance. At this point I was not paying much attention to him and figured he was just reaffirming the 9000 ft at kingston VOR. I believe my reply to him was 'roger.' once airborne we started the kingston 2 departure and about the time we got around to heading 270 degrees he said that we were supposed to be on a 'sekel 2 departure.' at that time I realized that he had cleared us for a different departure during the takeoff roll. We maintained the 270 degree heading and followed his instructions. Looking back, I should not have acknowledged his comments during the takeoff roll, as I'm sure this led him to believe that we understood him. I would, however, suggest that changing a departure during the takeoff roll is much too late. If it is necessary at that point to change something, then I believe that specific instructions should be given, such as 'maintain runway heading to 14 DME.' also, they watched us turn through 150 degrees before saying we were on the wrong departure.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACR WDB ACKNOWLEDGED AN AMENDED CLRNC NEW SID BUT FAILED TO COMPLY.
Narrative: WE HAD BEEN CLRED BY KINGSTON FOR THE KINGSTON 2 DEP OFF RWY 12 ENRTE TO JFK. APCHING THE END OF THE TAXIWAY WE WERE CLRED FOR TKOF. WX WAS CLR AND VISIBILITY UNLIMITED. AS WE WERE STARTING THE TKOF ROLL THE TWR ASKED IF WE COULD CROSS THE KINGSTON VOR AT 9000 FT, AT LEAST THAT IS WHAT I UNDERSTOOD HIM TO SAY. WELL INTO THE TKOF ROLL HE CAME BACK WITH ANOTHER CLRNC. AT THIS POINT I WAS NOT PAYING MUCH ATTN TO HIM AND FIGURED HE WAS JUST REAFFIRMING THE 9000 FT AT KINGSTON VOR. I BELIEVE MY REPLY TO HIM WAS 'ROGER.' ONCE AIRBORNE WE STARTED THE KINGSTON 2 DEP AND ABOUT THE TIME WE GOT AROUND TO HDG 270 DEGS HE SAID THAT WE WERE SUPPOSED TO BE ON A 'SEKEL 2 DEP.' AT THAT TIME I REALIZED THAT HE HAD CLRED US FOR A DIFFERENT DEP DURING THE TKOF ROLL. WE MAINTAINED THE 270 DEG HDG AND FOLLOWED HIS INSTRUCTIONS. LOOKING BACK, I SHOULD NOT HAVE ACKNOWLEDGED HIS COMMENTS DURING THE TKOF ROLL, AS I'M SURE THIS LED HIM TO BELIEVE THAT WE UNDERSTOOD HIM. I WOULD, HOWEVER, SUGGEST THAT CHANGING A DEP DURING THE TKOF ROLL IS MUCH TOO LATE. IF IT IS NECESSARY AT THAT POINT TO CHANGE SOMETHING, THEN I BELIEVE THAT SPECIFIC INSTRUCTIONS SHOULD BE GIVEN, SUCH AS 'MAINTAIN RWY HDG TO 14 DME.' ALSO, THEY WATCHED US TURN THROUGH 150 DEGS BEFORE SAYING WE WERE ON THE WRONG DEP.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.