Instructor with students on practice ILS is vectored over water beyond glide range.

Attributes
ACN	242024
Time
Date	199305
Day	Thu
Local Time Of Day	1201 To 1800
Place
Locale Reference	airport : cre
State Reference	SC
Altitude	msl bound lower : 2000 msl bound upper : 2000
Environment
Flight Conditions	Mixed
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : myr tower : nrt
Operator	general aviation : instructional
Make Model Name	Small Aircraft, High Wing, 1 Eng, Fixed Gear
Flight Phase	cruise other descent other
Route In Use	enroute : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	Other
Function	instruction : instructor
Qualification	pilot : commercial pilot : instrument pilot : cfi
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 120 flight time total : 1050 flight time type : 300
ASRS Report	242024
Person 2
Affiliation	Other
Function	flight crew : single pilot
Qualification	pilot : private
Events
Anomaly	non adherence other other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	other
Consequence	Other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	ATC Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	other
Situations
ATC Facility	procedure or policy : unspecified

Narrative:

Departed J21 for IFR flight to cre to train student in ILS approach procedures. About 15 NM southwest of cre, myrtle beach approach control starts vectoring us for ILS 23 at cre. Vector of 090 degrees was given to space us for a downwind. The cre airport is right on the atlantic ocean, so this vector took us about 2 mi off shore. Had to ask controller alternative vectors to prevent us from going out of gliding range to the shoreline. Controller responded and gave vector across the airport for a right downwind for the ILS 23. Completed approach and did 2 more ILS approachs during which we were provided with vectors over the land. Made fuel stop at cre and changed students. Took off VFR and contacted myrtle beach for 3 ILS 23 approachs. Controller establishes radar contact and starts vectoring us to the east, again over the ocean. The very same situation as earlier developed and after advising controller that we were not equipped with water survival gear, vectors changed to an over land right downwind. It seems that the standard procedure for ILS 23 at cre calls for a left downwind, offshore vector. This is an inherent dangerous procedure that does not take into account the possibility of an emergency in a single engine aircraft. The pilot himself is the one responsible to make sure that radar vectors don't bring him into an unsafe situation, but couldn't a facility be a step ahead and provide us with a more safer, logical procedure? Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following: reporter states that this is a fairly standard routine to practice approachs at this airport. Also seems standard procedure to be vectored over water so they must tell approach each time they are single engine and are not over water equipped. Reporter was encouraged to meet with other flight schools whom he says complain of same problem. They can consider a delegation to talk directly to TRACON management reference the problem.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: INSTRUCTOR WITH STUDENTS ON PRACTICE ILS IS VECTORED OVER WATER BEYOND GLIDE RANGE.

Narrative: DEPARTED J21 FOR IFR FLT TO CRE TO TRAIN STUDENT IN ILS APCH PROCS. ABOUT 15 NM SW OF CRE, MYRTLE BEACH APCH CTL STARTS VECTORING US FOR ILS 23 AT CRE. VECTOR OF 090 DEGS WAS GIVEN TO SPACE US FOR A DOWNWIND. THE CRE ARPT IS RIGHT ON THE ATLANTIC OCEAN, SO THIS VECTOR TOOK US ABOUT 2 MI OFF SHORE. HAD TO ASK CTLR ALTERNATIVE VECTORS TO PREVENT US FROM GOING OUT OF GLIDING RANGE TO THE SHORELINE. CTLR RESPONDED AND GAVE VECTOR ACROSS THE ARPT FOR A R DOWNWIND FOR THE ILS 23. COMPLETED APCH AND DID 2 MORE ILS APCHS DURING WHICH WE WERE PROVIDED WITH VECTORS OVER THE LAND. MADE FUEL STOP AT CRE AND CHANGED STUDENTS. TOOK OFF VFR AND CONTACTED MYRTLE BEACH FOR 3 ILS 23 APCHS. CTLR ESTABLISHES RADAR CONTACT AND STARTS VECTORING US TO THE E, AGAIN OVER THE OCEAN. THE VERY SAME SIT AS EARLIER DEVELOPED AND AFTER ADVISING CTLR THAT WE WERE NOT EQUIPPED WITH WATER SURVIVAL GEAR, VECTORS CHANGED TO AN OVER LAND R DOWNWIND. IT SEEMS THAT THE STANDARD PROC FOR ILS 23 AT CRE CALLS FOR A L DOWNWIND, OFFSHORE VECTOR. THIS IS AN INHERENT DANGEROUS PROC THAT DOES NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE POSSIBILITY OF AN EMER IN A SINGLE ENG ACFT. THE PLT HIMSELF IS THE ONE RESPONSIBLE TO MAKE SURE THAT RADAR VECTORS DON'T BRING HIM INTO AN UNSAFE SIT, BUT COULDN'T A FACILITY BE A STEP AHEAD AND PROVIDE US WITH A MORE SAFER, LOGICAL PROC? CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH REPORTER REVEALED THE FOLLOWING: RPTR STATES THAT THIS IS A FAIRLY STANDARD ROUTINE TO PRACTICE APCHS AT THIS ARPT. ALSO SEEMS STANDARD PROC TO BE VECTORED OVER WATER SO THEY MUST TELL APCH EACH TIME THEY ARE SINGLE ENG AND ARE NOT OVER WATER EQUIPPED. RPTR WAS ENCOURAGED TO MEET WITH OTHER FLT SCHOOLS WHOM HE SAYS COMPLAIN OF SAME PROB. THEY CAN CONSIDER A DELEGATION TO TALK DIRECTLY TO TRACON MGMNT REF THE PROB.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.