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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 256493 |
Time | |
Date | 199311 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : dca |
State Reference | DC |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 13000 msl bound upper : 14500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : dca |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | descent other |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : instrument |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 150 flight time total : 6000 flight time type : 750 |
ASRS Report | 256493 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : clearance |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : took evasive action |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 2000 vertical : 1000 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation other |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
We were descending through 14000 ft, cleared to 11000 with washington approach. Destination was dca. They were setting us up for the river visual to runway 18. The controller asked if we saw a runway 18 departure. We said yes, and she cleared him(he said he saw us) to climb through our cleared to altitude (11000 MSL). We both turned on our lights, and said that we would maintain visual separation. At 13000 we got a TA followed seconds later by an RA. The RA went from 'monitor vertical speed' which decreased our descent rate to 200 FPM from about 1500 FPM. Then it went to 'climb, climb' at about 2000 FPM up. At night in a busy area, we weren't sure that the RA was caused by our visual traffic and we followed the RA. We climbed to about 14500 MSL. When we told the controller her attitude was extremely bad, she was clearly annoyed, and very sarcastic. I think this controller's technique, though legal, is very bad. It is almost impossible to ignore a RA at night in a busy airspace. 40 mi southwest of dca is not a good place to play russian roulette with your jet!
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLC ACCEPTED 'MAINTAIN VISUAL SEPARATION' CLRNC BUT THEN COMPLIED WITH THE RESULTING TCASII RA.
Narrative: WE WERE DSNDING THROUGH 14000 FT, CLRED TO 11000 WITH WASHINGTON APCH. DEST WAS DCA. THEY WERE SETTING US UP FOR THE RIVER VISUAL TO RWY 18. THE CTLR ASKED IF WE SAW A RWY 18 DEP. WE SAID YES, AND SHE CLRED HIM(HE SAID HE SAW US) TO CLB THROUGH OUR CLRED TO ALT (11000 MSL). WE BOTH TURNED ON OUR LIGHTS, AND SAID THAT WE WOULD MAINTAIN VISUAL SEPARATION. AT 13000 WE GOT A TA FOLLOWED SECONDS LATER BY AN RA. THE RA WENT FROM 'MONITOR VERT SPD' WHICH DECREASED OUR DSCNT RATE TO 200 FPM FROM ABOUT 1500 FPM. THEN IT WENT TO 'CLB, CLB' AT ABOUT 2000 FPM UP. AT NIGHT IN A BUSY AREA, WE WEREN'T SURE THAT THE RA WAS CAUSED BY OUR VISUAL TFC AND WE FOLLOWED THE RA. WE CLBED TO ABOUT 14500 MSL. WHEN WE TOLD THE CTLR HER ATTITUDE WAS EXTREMELY BAD, SHE WAS CLRLY ANNOYED, AND VERY SARCASTIC. I THINK THIS CTLR'S TECHNIQUE, THOUGH LEGAL, IS VERY BAD. IT IS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE TO IGNORE A RA AT NIGHT IN A BUSY AIRSPACE. 40 MI SW OF DCA IS NOT A GOOD PLACE TO PLAY RUSSIAN ROULETTE WITH YOUR JET!
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.