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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 292963 |
Time | |
Date | 199501 |
Day | Thu |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : tlh |
State Reference | FL |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 2800 msl bound upper : 2800 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : tlh |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | general aviation : corporate |
Make Model Name | Cessna 170 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Flight Phase | cruise other |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | VFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 20000 flight time type : 1000 |
ASRS Report | 292963 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 2000 |
ASRS Report | 292962 |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : excursion from assigned altitude conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : clearance |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance other |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 3000 vertical : 700 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Air carrier X, after requesting ILS approach to tlh 27, controller told us to turn north (360 degrees) and maintain 7000 ft. I requested lower 4 times as we were high and tight (being held at 7000 ft). Finally controller gave us 3000 ft and a turn to 300 degrees to intercept localizer, cleared for ILS 27. As aircraft was intercepting localizer in the turn I noticed pop-up traffic on TCASII at 12 O'clock and 700 ft below us. I immediately asked controller about this as I placed my hands on controls ready to execute a go around. Controller became highly agitated saying that we were told to maintain 3000 ft. I answered that this won't work we will have to go around. He cleared traffic in front to turn right 360 degrees, then came back to us and said that we should have maintained our 3000 ft and we would have been 500 ft clear of traffic and that is all that he needs to provide us. He told us to continue approach, contact the tower, and call the tower (gave out phone number) if we had any further questions. Subject traffic was local based freight operator called Y. We thought we were cleared for approach. Controller never informed us that we had this traffic to follow who was then going to follow us. Supplemental information from acn 292962: approach controller vectored a C170 to be positioned under us on the approach, near the OM for runway 27. The C170 was also landing. Controller's plan was covert, and he intended for us to overfly this cessna at the marker, while 500 ft above the cessna. I intercepted the localizer and GS and began to follow the GS, and we got the TA from TCASII. We questioned the controller about the safety and sanity of this and demanded a resolution. Prior to starting our missed approach, the cessna was vectored off course and we continued on the ILS. The controller told us that we were not issued a clearance for the ILS and that they wanted us to have remained at our intercept altitude of 3000 ft.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACR X NON ADHERENCE TO ATC CLRNC TO MAINTAIN ALT, STARTED APCH.
Narrative: ACR X, AFTER REQUESTING ILS APCH TO TLH 27, CTLR TOLD US TO TURN N (360 DEGS) AND MAINTAIN 7000 FT. I REQUESTED LOWER 4 TIMES AS WE WERE HIGH AND TIGHT (BEING HELD AT 7000 FT). FINALLY CTLR GAVE US 3000 FT AND A TURN TO 300 DEGS TO INTERCEPT LOC, CLRED FOR ILS 27. AS ACFT WAS INTERCEPTING LOC IN THE TURN I NOTICED POP-UP TFC ON TCASII AT 12 O'CLOCK AND 700 FT BELOW US. I IMMEDIATELY ASKED CTLR ABOUT THIS AS I PLACED MY HANDS ON CTLS READY TO EXECUTE A GAR. CTLR BECAME HIGHLY AGITATED SAYING THAT WE WERE TOLD TO MAINTAIN 3000 FT. I ANSWERED THAT THIS WON'T WORK WE WILL HAVE TO GAR. HE CLRED TFC IN FRONT TO TURN R 360 DEGS, THEN CAME BACK TO US AND SAID THAT WE SHOULD HAVE MAINTAINED OUR 3000 FT AND WE WOULD HAVE BEEN 500 FT CLR OF TFC AND THAT IS ALL THAT HE NEEDS TO PROVIDE US. HE TOLD US TO CONTINUE APCH, CONTACT THE TWR, AND CALL THE TWR (GAVE OUT PHONE NUMBER) IF WE HAD ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS. SUBJECT TFC WAS LCL BASED FREIGHT OPERATOR CALLED Y. WE THOUGHT WE WERE CLRED FOR APCH. CTLR NEVER INFORMED US THAT WE HAD THIS TFC TO FOLLOW WHO WAS THEN GOING TO FOLLOW US. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 292962: APCH CTLR VECTORED A C170 TO BE POSITIONED UNDER US ON THE APCH, NEAR THE OM FOR RWY 27. THE C170 WAS ALSO LNDG. CTLR'S PLAN WAS COVERT, AND HE INTENDED FOR US TO OVERFLY THIS CESSNA AT THE MARKER, WHILE 500 FT ABOVE THE CESSNA. I INTERCEPTED THE LOC AND GS AND BEGAN TO FOLLOW THE GS, AND WE GOT THE TA FROM TCASII. WE QUESTIONED THE CTLR ABOUT THE SAFETY AND SANITY OF THIS AND DEMANDED A RESOLUTION. PRIOR TO STARTING OUR MISSED APCH, THE CESSNA WAS VECTORED OFF COURSE AND WE CONTINUED ON THE ILS. THE CTLR TOLD US THAT WE WERE NOT ISSUED A CLRNC FOR THE ILS AND THAT THEY WANTED US TO HAVE REMAINED AT OUR INTERCEPT ALT OF 3000 FT.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.