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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 368737 |
Time | |
Date | 199705 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : rno |
State Reference | NV |
Altitude | agl bound lower : 1500 agl bound upper : 2000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : rno |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Large Transport, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng |
Flight Phase | climbout : initial climbout : intermediate altitude |
Route In Use | departure : noise abatement departure other enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : second officer |
Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : atp pilot : flight engineer |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 180 flight time total : 8600 flight time type : 180 |
ASRS Report | 368737 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 170 flight time total : 7500 flight time type : 1500 |
ASRS Report | 368627 |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : undershoot inflight encounter other non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | atc equipment other atc equipment : unspecified aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : exited adverse environment |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
Departing reno airport (WX 110 ft scattered, more than 10 mi visibility, calm winds temperature 24 degrees C) runway 34L. Takeoff (ACARS) numbers showed 129 passenger. After takeoff on tower assigned heading (as per our air carrier's operations requirement) 360 degrees. Approximately 3-5 mi north of reno received both a GPWS terrain warning and tower called with low altitude warning. As we had the terrain in sight and knew we would clear it, we didn't need to overboost the engines or take evasive maneuvers. My concern is for future aircraft flying out of reno. ATC departure procedures call for a 330 degree heading (which we were originally assigned but our operations at our air carrier mandate 360 degrees from MM), the 330 degree heading would have compounded the problem, because the terrain is higher to the northwest. The second problem is that after takeoff, revised passenger totals sent via computer (after takeoff) showed a revised load of 132 passenger versus 129 passenger originally. We were still under our takeoff gross weight by 1200 pounds. What idented this error, was a required passenger count as per flight operations manual before takeoff. Given a scenario of a different carrier, in bad WX, hot day on a 330 degree heading this departure could turn out fatal. This is an example of noise abatement procedures requiring greater vertical climb and (should an engine fail) possibly jeopardizing safety. Supplemental information from acn 368627: at the time of the warning we were 1500 ft AGL and doing everything possible to increase our climb performance!
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: B727 DEP TO THE N FROM RNO ACTIVATES THE ATC LOW ALT WARNING SYS AND GPWS ON ACFT. CREW STATES THAT ACFT WAS JUST UNDER GROSS WT ALLOWABLE WITH A WARM TEMP. THEIR SCENARIO WAS LESSENED BY THE FACT THAT THEIR ACR HAS A 360 DEG HDG FOR CLB. THE PUBLISHED 330 DEG HDG WOULD BE MORE DANGEROUS.
Narrative: DEPARTING RENO ARPT (WX 110 FT SCATTERED, MORE THAN 10 MI VISIBILITY, CALM WINDS TEMP 24 DEGS C) RWY 34L. TKOF (ACARS) NUMBERS SHOWED 129 PAX. AFTER TKOF ON TWR ASSIGNED HEADING (AS PER OUR ACR'S OPS REQUIREMENT) 360 DEGS. APPROX 3-5 MI N OF RENO RECEIVED BOTH A GPWS TERRAIN WARNING AND TWR CALLED WITH LOW ALT WARNING. AS WE HAD THE TERRAIN IN SIGHT AND KNEW WE WOULD CLR IT, WE DIDN'T NEED TO OVERBOOST THE ENGS OR TAKE EVASIVE MANEUVERS. MY CONCERN IS FOR FUTURE ACFT FLYING OUT OF RENO. ATC DEP PROCS CALL FOR A 330 DEG HDG (WHICH WE WERE ORIGINALLY ASSIGNED BUT OUR OPS AT OUR ACR MANDATE 360 DEGS FROM MM), THE 330 DEG HDG WOULD HAVE COMPOUNDED THE PROB, BECAUSE THE TERRAIN IS HIGHER TO THE NW. THE SECOND PROB IS THAT AFTER TKOF, REVISED PAX TOTALS SENT VIA COMPUTER (AFTER TKOF) SHOWED A REVISED LOAD OF 132 PAX VERSUS 129 PAX ORIGINALLY. WE WERE STILL UNDER OUR TKOF GROSS WT BY 1200 LBS. WHAT IDENTED THIS ERROR, WAS A REQUIRED PAX COUNT AS PER FLT OPS MANUAL BEFORE TKOF. GIVEN A SCENARIO OF A DIFFERENT CARRIER, IN BAD WX, HOT DAY ON A 330 DEG HDG THIS DEP COULD TURN OUT FATAL. THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF NOISE ABATEMENT PROCS REQUIRING GREATER VERT CLB AND (SHOULD AN ENG FAIL) POSSIBLY JEOPARDIZING SAFETY. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 368627: AT THE TIME OF THE WARNING WE WERE 1500 FT AGL AND DOING EVERYTHING POSSIBLE TO INCREASE OUR CLB PERFORMANCE!
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.