Narrative:

As I got into the seat just south of montebello, we got a holding clearance at macey with an efc about 1 1/2 hours away. I wasn't too worried because our fine MD11 had been manufacturing gas all the way home for just such a contingency. We were well ahead of the planned burn. I figured that that line of WX we were looking at stretching away to the southwest was probably going to move on through atl in a few mins and they would be taking arrs again. We talked about it, and even discussed at what fuel state we would depart the pattern to go to our alternate, tys. In a min or two we got confirmation of just this sort of thinking from our dispatcher. He thought the level 5 WX along the arrival south of logen would be moving on through pretty quickly. Soon the sky began to fill up with aircraft. Heard all sorts of familiar voices. 'C' was just overhead in the stack at macey. Heard 'D' and 'east' entering at bebad on flight XXX from madrid. They were questioning their efc in disbelief. They were not stating their intentions to be gone long before then, but the tone of their voices spoke volumes. The sky got so full after awhile that the relatively inexperienced ZTL controller began to lose the picture. Every time she would slip a little bit there would be this strained silence and in a moment the supervisor would come on and put the picture back together again. We understood, but it was disconcerting. Everybody began to get up on the edge. They pull flight XXX out of the stack at bebad and give him priority over all the others. They begin to vector him around the west side, over the top for an approach to runway 27L. Now we are at the bottom of the stack and cleared in over logen at 13000 ft and 250 KTS. At logen we are turned south to expect ILS runway 26R. Several mins later, still at 13000 ft and 250 KTS, I ask what speed they might like. (My not so subtle prompt.) the nice man in the room with no windows says there has been a change of plan and we should turn to 120 degrees, descend to 6000 ft, and slow to 180 KTS, we are vectoring you for an ILS to runway 27L. We put the slats out and the boards out and are thinking maybe we might need the gear. There are cells all around, but approach control is doing a good job of picking us through them. We are in some rain and heavy cloud, but the ride is ok. We are turned to the south. Then quickly to the southwest, obviously to join the localizer. Having gotten the box set up, I am getting ready to arm the approach. The man says, 'can you tighten that turn?' first officer knocks off the autoplt and rolls it up pretty good. We say 'roger, tighten turn.' then he says 'bring it on around to 320 degrees. Maybe you better climb back up to 7000 ft. I think we are going to put you back on runway 26R. What is your altitude?' right in here we get this yellow TA and almost immediately we get the red RA and a command to 'descend, descend.' the green arc is at 2000 FPM, and first officer goes for it. 'What is your altitude? Maybe you better climb back up to 7500 ft. Turn right to a heading of 360 degrees and we will put you in a big circle to rejoin the runway 26R localizer.' the TCASII advisory disappears to the left. I report that our altitude is now about 6300 ft. I begin to push first officer's throttles up so he can climb back to the assigned altitude. The descent stops and we begin to climb, rolling out on 360 degrees. It takes us all a moment to realize that the speed brakes are still out. We tune the radios and set up the map for an approach to runway 26R. We are vectored back out to the east and back around to join this final at 7000 ft. We join, the approach is normal. First officer makes a nice landing. We are sitting between the runways waiting to get across, and thinking about a change of underwear, when we see and hear XXX, our low state aircraft, finally land behind another aircraft on runway 26R. They must have been vectored all over middle georgia. We park at the gate and deplane. Some of our passenger and particularly some of our flight attendants are ashen faced. After all our folks are off, they rush over and want to know what happened. We tell them. They shrug it off and go on home. I am sure many of these fine crew members, and certainly nearly all of our passenger, will never know exactly how lucky they are that air carrier has installed the latest version of TCASII on our fleet. It saved their bacon. Mine too. In the operations lounge I call flight control and ask how I might get in touch with atl approach control. I am put in touch with mr M. He is on the flight control ATC liaison desk. He puts me on a 3 way hook up with the supervisor of approach control. A nice man comes on and I explain that I am not after anybody's certificate, but that an incident has just occurred. I explain and ask that he pull the tapes for this incident and use it for training and a good debrief of all parties. He thanked me and said he would. I leave concourse X and go over to concourse Y on another errand. I am walking through the lounge when I hear these guys talking. A captain and a first officer are holding forth about a TCASII RA that they experienced on the runway 27L final. Captain 'F' and first officer 'G' had been in a B767-300 full of people coming from san juan. Flight was being vectored for an approach to the south complex when he got his TCASII RA. His controller was telling him to descend and his TCASII RA told him to climb. My controller told me to climb and my TCASII told me to descend. We compared notes. We had both been belly to belly out there working 2 different frequencys. I had been joining the localizer from the north, he from the south. I was in a hard right turn, he was in a left turn. 'F' had gotten a glimpse of me through the misty cloud. He said we went under him by about 200 ft vertically and maybe 1000-2000 ft ahead. He saw us and realized we had missed him, and held steady. We were lucky this day, but the moral is that atl can very quickly become saturated. Approach control is under enormous pressure to accept more and more aircraft. At some point our company and our government and our union are going to have to realize that atlanta, with 2 runways cannot be expected to safely sustain operations that would choke O'hare who has 6. We need to accept these realities and plan a schedule accordingly. Supplemental information from acn 377945: I was relief officer on air carrier flight xyfrom london to atlanta. After a lengthy hold on approach to atlanta, we were given vectors for the field and told to expect the ILS to runway 26R. We were given numerous stepdowns, and approaching a normal dogleg to ILS runway 26R, were told to accomplish the ILS to runway 27L. The first officer was flying the aircraft and captain was performing the PNF duties. On a heading of 160 degrees after a stepdown to 7000 ft MSL we were given a turn to 220 degrees. During the turn the controller told us to switch back to the ILS runway 26R with an initial heading of 340 degrees. He then asked us to 'tighten up' the turn. Almost immediately TCASII gave us a 'descend now' RA. The vsi was directing about a 4000 FPM descent. The captain hadn't heard the TCASII RA, but did hear the controller telling us to climb to 7500 ft (we were then down to about 6200 ft).

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: AN MD11 HAS AN ARR CONFLICT WITH A B767-300. RPTR'S ACFT RECEIVES A TCASII RA AND ACFT DSNDS DURING APCH AT ATL IN RESPONSE TO TCASII RA. CTLR REQUESTED FLT TO CLB.

Narrative: AS I GOT INTO THE SEAT JUST S OF MONTEBELLO, WE GOT A HOLDING CLRNC AT MACEY WITH AN EFC ABOUT 1 1/2 HRS AWAY. I WASN'T TOO WORRIED BECAUSE OUR FINE MD11 HAD BEEN MANUFACTURING GAS ALL THE WAY HOME FOR JUST SUCH A CONTINGENCY. WE WERE WELL AHEAD OF THE PLANNED BURN. I FIGURED THAT THAT LINE OF WX WE WERE LOOKING AT STRETCHING AWAY TO THE SW WAS PROBABLY GOING TO MOVE ON THROUGH ATL IN A FEW MINS AND THEY WOULD BE TAKING ARRS AGAIN. WE TALKED ABOUT IT, AND EVEN DISCUSSED AT WHAT FUEL STATE WE WOULD DEPART THE PATTERN TO GO TO OUR ALTERNATE, TYS. IN A MIN OR TWO WE GOT CONFIRMATION OF JUST THIS SORT OF THINKING FROM OUR DISPATCHER. HE THOUGHT THE LEVEL 5 WX ALONG THE ARR S OF LOGEN WOULD BE MOVING ON THROUGH PRETTY QUICKLY. SOON THE SKY BEGAN TO FILL UP WITH ACFT. HEARD ALL SORTS OF FAMILIAR VOICES. 'C' WAS JUST OVERHEAD IN THE STACK AT MACEY. HEARD 'D' AND 'E' ENTERING AT BEBAD ON FLT XXX FROM MADRID. THEY WERE QUESTIONING THEIR EFC IN DISBELIEF. THEY WERE NOT STATING THEIR INTENTIONS TO BE GONE LONG BEFORE THEN, BUT THE TONE OF THEIR VOICES SPOKE VOLUMES. THE SKY GOT SO FULL AFTER AWHILE THAT THE RELATIVELY INEXPERIENCED ZTL CTLR BEGAN TO LOSE THE PICTURE. EVERY TIME SHE WOULD SLIP A LITTLE BIT THERE WOULD BE THIS STRAINED SILENCE AND IN A MOMENT THE SUPVR WOULD COME ON AND PUT THE PICTURE BACK TOGETHER AGAIN. WE UNDERSTOOD, BUT IT WAS DISCONCERTING. EVERYBODY BEGAN TO GET UP ON THE EDGE. THEY PULL FLT XXX OUT OF THE STACK AT BEBAD AND GIVE HIM PRIORITY OVER ALL THE OTHERS. THEY BEGIN TO VECTOR HIM AROUND THE W SIDE, OVER THE TOP FOR AN APCH TO RWY 27L. NOW WE ARE AT THE BOTTOM OF THE STACK AND CLRED IN OVER LOGEN AT 13000 FT AND 250 KTS. AT LOGEN WE ARE TURNED S TO EXPECT ILS RWY 26R. SEVERAL MINS LATER, STILL AT 13000 FT AND 250 KTS, I ASK WHAT SPD THEY MIGHT LIKE. (MY NOT SO SUBTLE PROMPT.) THE NICE MAN IN THE ROOM WITH NO WINDOWS SAYS THERE HAS BEEN A CHANGE OF PLAN AND WE SHOULD TURN TO 120 DEGS, DSND TO 6000 FT, AND SLOW TO 180 KTS, WE ARE VECTORING YOU FOR AN ILS TO RWY 27L. WE PUT THE SLATS OUT AND THE BOARDS OUT AND ARE THINKING MAYBE WE MIGHT NEED THE GEAR. THERE ARE CELLS ALL AROUND, BUT APCH CTL IS DOING A GOOD JOB OF PICKING US THROUGH THEM. WE ARE IN SOME RAIN AND HVY CLOUD, BUT THE RIDE IS OK. WE ARE TURNED TO THE S. THEN QUICKLY TO THE SW, OBVIOUSLY TO JOIN THE LOC. HAVING GOTTEN THE BOX SET UP, I AM GETTING READY TO ARM THE APCH. THE MAN SAYS, 'CAN YOU TIGHTEN THAT TURN?' FO KNOCKS OFF THE AUTOPLT AND ROLLS IT UP PRETTY GOOD. WE SAY 'ROGER, TIGHTEN TURN.' THEN HE SAYS 'BRING IT ON AROUND TO 320 DEGS. MAYBE YOU BETTER CLB BACK UP TO 7000 FT. I THINK WE ARE GOING TO PUT YOU BACK ON RWY 26R. WHAT IS YOUR ALT?' RIGHT IN HERE WE GET THIS YELLOW TA AND ALMOST IMMEDIATELY WE GET THE RED RA AND A COMMAND TO 'DSND, DSND.' THE GREEN ARC IS AT 2000 FPM, AND FO GOES FOR IT. 'WHAT IS YOUR ALT? MAYBE YOU BETTER CLB BACK UP TO 7500 FT. TURN R TO A HDG OF 360 DEGS AND WE WILL PUT YOU IN A BIG CIRCLE TO REJOIN THE RWY 26R LOC.' THE TCASII ADVISORY DISAPPEARS TO THE L. I RPT THAT OUR ALT IS NOW ABOUT 6300 FT. I BEGIN TO PUSH FO'S THROTTLES UP SO HE CAN CLB BACK TO THE ASSIGNED ALT. THE DSCNT STOPS AND WE BEGIN TO CLB, ROLLING OUT ON 360 DEGS. IT TAKES US ALL A MOMENT TO REALIZE THAT THE SPD BRAKES ARE STILL OUT. WE TUNE THE RADIOS AND SET UP THE MAP FOR AN APCH TO RWY 26R. WE ARE VECTORED BACK OUT TO THE E AND BACK AROUND TO JOIN THIS FINAL AT 7000 FT. WE JOIN, THE APCH IS NORMAL. FO MAKES A NICE LNDG. WE ARE SITTING BTWN THE RWYS WAITING TO GET ACROSS, AND THINKING ABOUT A CHANGE OF UNDERWEAR, WHEN WE SEE AND HEAR XXX, OUR LOW STATE ACFT, FINALLY LAND BEHIND ANOTHER ACFT ON RWY 26R. THEY MUST HAVE BEEN VECTORED ALL OVER MIDDLE GEORGIA. WE PARK AT THE GATE AND DEPLANE. SOME OF OUR PAX AND PARTICULARLY SOME OF OUR FLT ATTENDANTS ARE ASHEN FACED. AFTER ALL OUR FOLKS ARE OFF, THEY RUSH OVER AND WANT TO KNOW WHAT HAPPENED. WE TELL THEM. THEY SHRUG IT OFF AND GO ON HOME. I AM SURE MANY OF THESE FINE CREW MEMBERS, AND CERTAINLY NEARLY ALL OF OUR PAX, WILL NEVER KNOW EXACTLY HOW LUCKY THEY ARE THAT ACR HAS INSTALLED THE LATEST VERSION OF TCASII ON OUR FLEET. IT SAVED THEIR BACON. MINE TOO. IN THE OPS LOUNGE I CALL FLT CTL AND ASK HOW I MIGHT GET IN TOUCH WITH ATL APCH CTL. I AM PUT IN TOUCH WITH MR M. HE IS ON THE FLT CTL ATC LIAISON DESK. HE PUTS ME ON A 3 WAY HOOK UP WITH THE SUPVR OF APCH CTL. A NICE MAN COMES ON AND I EXPLAIN THAT I AM NOT AFTER ANYBODY'S CERTIFICATE, BUT THAT AN INCIDENT HAS JUST OCCURRED. I EXPLAIN AND ASK THAT HE PULL THE TAPES FOR THIS INCIDENT AND USE IT FOR TRAINING AND A GOOD DEBRIEF OF ALL PARTIES. HE THANKED ME AND SAID HE WOULD. I LEAVE CONCOURSE X AND GO OVER TO CONCOURSE Y ON ANOTHER ERRAND. I AM WALKING THROUGH THE LOUNGE WHEN I HEAR THESE GUYS TALKING. A CAPT AND A FO ARE HOLDING FORTH ABOUT A TCASII RA THAT THEY EXPERIENCED ON THE RWY 27L FINAL. CAPT 'F' AND FO 'G' HAD BEEN IN A B767-300 FULL OF PEOPLE COMING FROM SAN JUAN. FLT WAS BEING VECTORED FOR AN APCH TO THE SOUTH COMPLEX WHEN HE GOT HIS TCASII RA. HIS CTLR WAS TELLING HIM TO DSND AND HIS TCASII RA TOLD HIM TO CLB. MY CTLR TOLD ME TO CLB AND MY TCASII TOLD ME TO DSND. WE COMPARED NOTES. WE HAD BOTH BEEN BELLY TO BELLY OUT THERE WORKING 2 DIFFERENT FREQS. I HAD BEEN JOINING THE LOC FROM THE N, HE FROM THE S. I WAS IN A HARD R TURN, HE WAS IN A L TURN. 'F' HAD GOTTEN A GLIMPSE OF ME THROUGH THE MISTY CLOUD. HE SAID WE WENT UNDER HIM BY ABOUT 200 FT VERTLY AND MAYBE 1000-2000 FT AHEAD. HE SAW US AND REALIZED WE HAD MISSED HIM, AND HELD STEADY. WE WERE LUCKY THIS DAY, BUT THE MORAL IS THAT ATL CAN VERY QUICKLY BECOME SATURATED. APCH CTL IS UNDER ENORMOUS PRESSURE TO ACCEPT MORE AND MORE ACFT. AT SOME POINT OUR COMPANY AND OUR GOV AND OUR UNION ARE GOING TO HAVE TO REALIZE THAT ATLANTA, WITH 2 RWYS CANNOT BE EXPECTED TO SAFELY SUSTAIN OPS THAT WOULD CHOKE O'HARE WHO HAS 6. WE NEED TO ACCEPT THESE REALITIES AND PLAN A SCHEDULE ACCORDINGLY. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 377945: I WAS RELIEF OFFICER ON ACR FLT XYFROM LONDON TO ATLANTA. AFTER A LENGTHY HOLD ON APCH TO ATLANTA, WE WERE GIVEN VECTORS FOR THE FIELD AND TOLD TO EXPECT THE ILS TO RWY 26R. WE WERE GIVEN NUMEROUS STEPDOWNS, AND APCHING A NORMAL DOGLEG TO ILS RWY 26R, WERE TOLD TO ACCOMPLISH THE ILS TO RWY 27L. THE FO WAS FLYING THE ACFT AND CAPT WAS PERFORMING THE PNF DUTIES. ON A HDG OF 160 DEGS AFTER A STEPDOWN TO 7000 FT MSL WE WERE GIVEN A TURN TO 220 DEGS. DURING THE TURN THE CTLR TOLD US TO SWITCH BACK TO THE ILS RWY 26R WITH AN INITIAL HDG OF 340 DEGS. HE THEN ASKED US TO 'TIGHTEN UP' THE TURN. ALMOST IMMEDIATELY TCASII GAVE US A 'DSND NOW' RA. THE VSI WAS DIRECTING ABOUT A 4000 FPM DSCNT. THE CAPT HADN'T HEARD THE TCASII RA, BUT DID HEAR THE CTLR TELLING US TO CLB TO 7500 FT (WE WERE THEN DOWN TO ABOUT 6200 FT).

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.