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While attempting to sequence consecutive visual approachs, las approach controller misjudges spacing needed for a DC10 being vectored to follow a B727. DC10 eventually changed to another runway.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 414577 |
| Time | |
| Date | 199809 |
| Day | Thu |
| Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | airport : las |
| State Reference | NV |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 6000 msl bound upper : 6000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : las |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | DC-10 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
| Navigation In Use | Other |
| Flight Phase | descent : approach descent other |
| Route In Use | approach : visual |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | B727 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
| Flight Phase | descent : approach descent other |
| Route In Use | approach : visual arrival other |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 15000 flight time type : 3000 |
| ASRS Report | 414577 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : required legal separation |
| Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other controllera other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | none taken : insufficient time |
| Consequence | Other |
| Miss Distance | horizontal : 12000 vertical : 500 |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
| Air Traffic Incident | Operational Error |
Narrative:
We (aircraft X) were to follow a B727 on the localizer runway 25L into las. Approach control points out traffic on a left base for us to follow. Could not see him, however, on the TCASII we saw traffic 2 mi at our 11 O'clock. This was not going to work out. ATC didn't know what to do and told me to maintain 6000 ft and present heading. What they were hoping for was for us to call the traffic in sight, and give us the responsibility for traffic separation. We asked for runway 25R and got it, but this made for a very unstable, high approach.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: WHILE ATTEMPTING TO SEQUENCE CONSECUTIVE VISUAL APCHS, LAS APCH CTLR MISJUDGES SPACING NEEDED FOR A DC10 BEING VECTORED TO FOLLOW A B727. DC10 EVENTUALLY CHANGED TO ANOTHER RWY.
Narrative: WE (ACFT X) WERE TO FOLLOW A B727 ON THE LOC RWY 25L INTO LAS. APCH CTL POINTS OUT TFC ON A L BASE FOR US TO FOLLOW. COULD NOT SEE HIM, HOWEVER, ON THE TCASII WE SAW TFC 2 MI AT OUR 11 O'CLOCK. THIS WAS NOT GOING TO WORK OUT. ATC DIDN'T KNOW WHAT TO DO AND TOLD ME TO MAINTAIN 6000 FT AND PRESENT HDG. WHAT THEY WERE HOPING FOR WAS FOR US TO CALL THE TFC IN SIGHT, AND GIVE US THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR TFC SEPARATION. WE ASKED FOR RWY 25R AND GOT IT, BUT THIS MADE FOR A VERY UNSTABLE, HIGH APCH.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.