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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 436691 |
Time | |
Date | 199905 |
Day | Mon |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : phk.airport |
State Reference | FL |
Altitude | msl single value : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zma.artcc tracon : pbi.tracon |
Operator | general aviation : instructional |
Make Model Name | PA-34-200T Turbo Seneca II |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Navigation In Use | other vortac |
Flight Phase | landing : missed approach landing : go around landing : touch and go |
Route In Use | approach : traffic pattern approach : instrument non precision approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | other |
Function | instruction : instructor |
Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : instrument pilot : multi engine pilot : commercial |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 175 flight time total : 1200 flight time type : 250 |
ASRS Report | 436691 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | other |
Function | instruction : trainee |
Qualification | pilot : private |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe inflight encounter : skydivers |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : took precautionary avoidance action |
Consequence | other |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Airport |
Primary Problem | Airport |
Air Traffic Incident | Inter Facility Coordination Failure |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : phk.comrdo |
Narrative:
As part of our instrument training syllabus, we often go the pahokee to do VOR approachs. Pahokee has a VOR on the field and is a non twred airport. Generally, west palm beach approach will clear you to the phk VOR and then for the full VOR approach, with the missed approach instructions being to execute the published missed (and hold over the VOR) except climb to 3000 ft. On more than one occasion, just after being given a frequency change to unicom (usually just over or near the VOR), I have heard 'jumpers away.' this has also happened while on the procedure turn, or inbound from the procedure turn. In order to avoid conflict, instead of performing the published missed, I'll proceed north of the field and contact approach once at 3000 ft. To date, I have been able to be away from the vicinity of the drop zone before the jumpers arrive. However, it was brought to my attention that palm beach approach does not provide advisories about the parachute jumping -- the jump plane is only in contact with ZMA who controls the airspace above (the plane visually drops jumpers at 13500 ft MSL). I have spoken to other instructors who have had similar experiences. While I support parachute jumping, I feel that the situation at pahokee is unnecessarily dangerous. It is not always possible to monitor unicom while in communication with approach, and approach does not provide advisories that parachute jumping is about to take place. In order to avoid conflict, it is necessary to deviate from ATC instructions for the missed approach. There is a lot of instrument flight training at pahokee, and it seems like it is only a matter of time before a jumper and a plane collide. I hope a solution will be found that will not limit either parachute jumping or flight training. Perhaps ZMA could advise palm beach approach when jumping is about to occur. Pilots need this advisory, and until I almost had a conflict, I didn't even know palm beach was not in contact with the jump plane. Please feel free to contact me if you have any further questions or need clarification. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following information: this instructor pilot said that the flight school attempts to use the phk airport for VOR approachs and other pattern work because it is not very busy with other aircraft traffic. However, there is a problem with parachutists and random other aircraft traffic. These various classes of traffic are usually in contact with different control facilities or on the frequency used as unicom or CTAF. The instructor said that the flying school seems to understand their pilot's concern about the traffic control problems at phk, but also is demanding that the flight time is used as efficiently as possible. This means that even with the known problems, phk is still an attractive practice airport for the school. The instructor thinks that the problems would be, in part, solved if the ARTCC and the approach control could coordination with each other and then broadcast traffic information on the unicom and CTAF frequency.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: IN INSTRUCTOR PLT FOR A FLT SCHOOL, OPERATING A PA34T, RPTS THAT THE TFC INFO AT PHK IS NOT OFTEN PASSED TO ACFT OPERATING AT THE ARPT. THIS HAS LED TO SOME DIFFICULTY IN AVOIDING PARACHUTISTS WHO JUMP ON ARTCC FREQ AND ARRIVING TFC ON PBI APCH CTL FREQ AND LCL TFC ON THE UNICOM OR CTAF FREQ.
Narrative: AS PART OF OUR INST TRAINING SYLLABUS, WE OFTEN GO THE PAHOKEE TO DO VOR APCHS. PAHOKEE HAS A VOR ON THE FIELD AND IS A NON TWRED ARPT. GENERALLY, WEST PALM BEACH APCH WILL CLR YOU TO THE PHK VOR AND THEN FOR THE FULL VOR APCH, WITH THE MISSED APCH INSTRUCTIONS BEING TO EXECUTE THE PUBLISHED MISSED (AND HOLD OVER THE VOR) EXCEPT CLB TO 3000 FT. ON MORE THAN ONE OCCASION, JUST AFTER BEING GIVEN A FREQ CHANGE TO UNICOM (USUALLY JUST OVER OR NEAR THE VOR), I HAVE HEARD 'JUMPERS AWAY.' THIS HAS ALSO HAPPENED WHILE ON THE PROC TURN, OR INBOUND FROM THE PROC TURN. IN ORDER TO AVOID CONFLICT, INSTEAD OF PERFORMING THE PUBLISHED MISSED, I'LL PROCEED N OF THE FIELD AND CONTACT APCH ONCE AT 3000 FT. TO DATE, I HAVE BEEN ABLE TO BE AWAY FROM THE VICINITY OF THE DROP ZONE BEFORE THE JUMPERS ARRIVE. HOWEVER, IT WAS BROUGHT TO MY ATTN THAT PALM BEACH APCH DOES NOT PROVIDE ADVISORIES ABOUT THE PARACHUTE JUMPING -- THE JUMP PLANE IS ONLY IN CONTACT WITH ZMA WHO CTLS THE AIRSPACE ABOVE (THE PLANE VISUALLY DROPS JUMPERS AT 13500 FT MSL). I HAVE SPOKEN TO OTHER INSTRUCTORS WHO HAVE HAD SIMILAR EXPERIENCES. WHILE I SUPPORT PARACHUTE JUMPING, I FEEL THAT THE SIT AT PAHOKEE IS UNNECESSARILY DANGEROUS. IT IS NOT ALWAYS POSSIBLE TO MONITOR UNICOM WHILE IN COM WITH APCH, AND APCH DOES NOT PROVIDE ADVISORIES THAT PARACHUTE JUMPING IS ABOUT TO TAKE PLACE. IN ORDER TO AVOID CONFLICT, IT IS NECESSARY TO DEVIATE FROM ATC INSTRUCTIONS FOR THE MISSED APCH. THERE IS A LOT OF INST FLT TRAINING AT PAHOKEE, AND IT SEEMS LIKE IT IS ONLY A MATTER OF TIME BEFORE A JUMPER AND A PLANE COLLIDE. I HOPE A SOLUTION WILL BE FOUND THAT WILL NOT LIMIT EITHER PARACHUTE JUMPING OR FLT TRAINING. PERHAPS ZMA COULD ADVISE PALM BEACH APCH WHEN JUMPING IS ABOUT TO OCCUR. PLTS NEED THIS ADVISORY, AND UNTIL I ALMOST HAD A CONFLICT, I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW PALM BEACH WAS NOT IN CONTACT WITH THE JUMP PLANE. PLEASE FEEL FREE TO CONTACT ME IF YOU HAVE ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS OR NEED CLARIFICATION. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO: THIS INSTRUCTOR PLT SAID THAT THE FLT SCHOOL ATTEMPTS TO USE THE PHK ARPT FOR VOR APCHS AND OTHER PATTERN WORK BECAUSE IT IS NOT VERY BUSY WITH OTHER ACFT TFC. HOWEVER, THERE IS A PROB WITH PARACHUTISTS AND RANDOM OTHER ACFT TFC. THESE VARIOUS CLASSES OF TFC ARE USUALLY IN CONTACT WITH DIFFERENT CTL FACILITIES OR ON THE FREQ USED AS UNICOM OR CTAF. THE INSTRUCTOR SAID THAT THE FLYING SCHOOL SEEMS TO UNDERSTAND THEIR PLT'S CONCERN ABOUT THE TFC CTL PROBS AT PHK, BUT ALSO IS DEMANDING THAT THE FLT TIME IS USED AS EFFICIENTLY AS POSSIBLE. THIS MEANS THAT EVEN WITH THE KNOWN PROBS, PHK IS STILL AN ATTRACTIVE PRACTICE ARPT FOR THE SCHOOL. THE INSTRUCTOR THINKS THAT THE PROBS WOULD BE, IN PART, SOLVED IF THE ARTCC AND THE APCH CTL COULD COORD WITH EACH OTHER AND THEN BROADCAST TFC INFO ON THE UNICOM AND CTAF FREQ.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.