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Cvg challenges B757 flight crew speed change on final without prior coordination as flight crew encounters WX.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 494553 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200012 |
| Day | Mon |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | airport : cvg.airport |
| State Reference | KY |
| Altitude | msl single value : 3000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | IMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : cvg.tracon |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | B757-200 |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Navigation In Use | ils localizer & glide slope : 18r |
| Flight Phase | descent : approach |
| Route In Use | approach : instrument precision arrival : on vectors |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 6500 flight time type : 1000 |
| ASRS Report | 494553 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | inflight encounter : weather non adherence : clearance other anomaly |
| Independent Detector | atc equipment other atc equipment : radar other controllera other flight crewa other flight crewb |
| Resolutory Action | controller : issued advisory |
| Consequence | faa : investigated faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | Flight Crew Human Performance Weather ATC Human Performance |
| Primary Problem | Weather |
Narrative:
On approach to cvg, ATC issued a base turn to the ILS runway 18R (cvg) to a heading of 090 degrees. During our base turn, we had approximately 50 KTS of tailwind, and our ground speed was over 300 KTS. The WX was approximately 600 ft 2 miles and the captain elected to fly this approach with raw data (no FMS, flight director, autothrottle, or autoplt). I was PNF and chose to update the MCP for myself and xchk his approach. As we turned to final, the wind shifted to a 45 KT headwind. On final, ATC issued a speed of 200 KTS because we only had a 500 FPM descent on final. ATC said maintain 3000 ft, speed 180 KTS, to logoz intersection, cleared ILS runway 18R. The captain was at flaps 20 degrees, 180 KTS and approximately 1.5 mi from logoz. The captain commanded the gear down. Prior to logoz (1 mi), ATC asked us our speed and I responded 'we are just slowing to final speed.' ATC said 'you slowed too soon.' after landing, he told us to call the tower supervisor on the telephone. The captain called and talked to the supervisor and told him why he slowed (because of the IFR WX and this is the normal time to slow at the FAF). I think that the tower controller did not believe we were at 180 KTS, due to the 45 KT headwind, and his traffic was creeping up behind us. Again, the WX was IFR and we were doing standard company procedures.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: CVG CHALLENGES B757 FLC SPD CHANGE ON FINAL WITHOUT PRIOR COORD AS FLC ENCOUNTERS WX.
Narrative: ON APCH TO CVG, ATC ISSUED A BASE TURN TO THE ILS RWY 18R (CVG) TO A HDG OF 090 DEGS. DURING OUR BASE TURN, WE HAD APPROX 50 KTS OF TAILWIND, AND OUR GND SPD WAS OVER 300 KTS. THE WX WAS APPROX 600 FT 2 MILES AND THE CAPT ELECTED TO FLY THIS APCH WITH RAW DATA (NO FMS, FLT DIRECTOR, AUTOTHROTTLE, OR AUTOPLT). I WAS PNF AND CHOSE TO UPDATE THE MCP FOR MYSELF AND XCHK HIS APCH. AS WE TURNED TO FINAL, THE WIND SHIFTED TO A 45 KT HEADWIND. ON FINAL, ATC ISSUED A SPD OF 200 KTS BECAUSE WE ONLY HAD A 500 FPM DSCNT ON FINAL. ATC SAID MAINTAIN 3000 FT, SPD 180 KTS, TO LOGOZ INTXN, CLRED ILS RWY 18R. THE CAPT WAS AT FLAPS 20 DEGS, 180 KTS AND APPROX 1.5 MI FROM LOGOZ. THE CAPT COMMANDED THE GEAR DOWN. PRIOR TO LOGOZ (1 MI), ATC ASKED US OUR SPD AND I RESPONDED 'WE ARE JUST SLOWING TO FINAL SPD.' ATC SAID 'YOU SLOWED TOO SOON.' AFTER LNDG, HE TOLD US TO CALL THE TWR SUPVR ON THE TELEPHONE. THE CAPT CALLED AND TALKED TO THE SUPVR AND TOLD HIM WHY HE SLOWED (BECAUSE OF THE IFR WX AND THIS IS THE NORMAL TIME TO SLOW AT THE FAF). I THINK THAT THE TWR CTLR DID NOT BELIEVE WE WERE AT 180 KTS, DUE TO THE 45 KT HEADWIND, AND HIS TFC WAS CREEPING UP BEHIND US. AGAIN, THE WX WAS IFR AND WE WERE DOING STANDARD COMPANY PROCS.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.