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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 514314 |
Time | |
Date | 200106 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | navaid : sjc.vor |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl single value : 3500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : o90.tracon |
Operator | general aviation : personal |
Make Model Name | Skyhawk 172/Cutlass 172 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Flight Phase | cruise : level |
Flight Plan | None |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : o90.tracon |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | MD-80 Series (DC-9-80) Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | ils localizer & glide slope : 30 |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | arrival : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | other |
Function | instruction : instructor |
Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 40 flight time total : 2600 flight time type : 7500 |
ASRS Report | 514314 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne critical other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | atc equipment other atc equipment : radar aircraft equipment : tcas other controllera other flight crewa other flight crewb |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued advisory controller : issued new clearance flight crew : took evasive action flight crew : took precautionary avoidance action |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 6000 vertical : 500 |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Aircraft Flight Crew Human Performance Airspace Structure ATC Human Performance |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Narrative:
Problem: TCASII advisory on other (airline aircraft) caused climb when not needed. Contributing factor was imprecise ATC instruction to my aircraft. Dual training flight departing sjc runway 29 on left downwind. Approach directed my aircraft to a point south of sjc, then gave us 'resume own navigation, remain clear of runway 30 final approach course' or similar instruction, no distance specified. Destination was south county (Q99) which is right under the final for runway 30. I dialed in the runway 30 localizer frequency which showed full deflection. My student slowly drifted from heading approximately 120 degrees to about 110 degrees magnetic. ATC pointed out traffic as a jet turning to the final for runway 30. We made visual contact and were well clear. The jet reported a TA and then RA. ATC then asked us to stay '2 mi' and then 3 mi west of the final. ATC's instruction to 'remain clear of the approach course' was not specific enough. What was fine for VFR separation obviously was not good enough for TCASII. ATC needs to be more specific here and since distance is hard to estimate precisely to an invisible line (the localizer), a distance may not be enough. A vector works better. Also, TCASII seems to create problems when none exist. The jet had us in sight and we them. Nearest distance was probably 1.5 mi horizontal and 500-1500 ft vertical, yet the jet had to climb, leading to a less stable descent for him, and a wide divert around the localizer for us. Does TCASII need to enforce IFR separation under VFR conditions? Perhaps it's a limitation of the technology, but it does have safety (unneeded go around) and efficiency impacts on operations.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: WHEN TURNING FINAL TO SJC RWY 30, AN MD80 INITIATES TCASII MANEUVER DUE TO POTENTIALLY CONFLICTING VFR C172 TRANSITIONING OPPOSITE DIRECTION FROM SJC.
Narrative: PROB: TCASII ADVISORY ON OTHER (AIRLINE ACFT) CAUSED CLB WHEN NOT NEEDED. CONTRIBUTING FACTOR WAS IMPRECISE ATC INSTRUCTION TO MY ACFT. DUAL TRAINING FLT DEPARTING SJC RWY 29 ON L DOWNWIND. APCH DIRECTED MY ACFT TO A POINT S OF SJC, THEN GAVE US 'RESUME OWN NAV, REMAIN CLR OF RWY 30 FINAL APCH COURSE' OR SIMILAR INSTRUCTION, NO DISTANCE SPECIFIED. DEST WAS SOUTH COUNTY (Q99) WHICH IS RIGHT UNDER THE FINAL FOR RWY 30. I DIALED IN THE RWY 30 LOC FREQ WHICH SHOWED FULL DEFLECTION. MY STUDENT SLOWLY DRIFTED FROM HEADING APPROX 120 DEGS TO ABOUT 110 DEGS MAGNETIC. ATC POINTED OUT TFC AS A JET TURNING TO THE FINAL FOR RWY 30. WE MADE VISUAL CONTACT AND WERE WELL CLR. THE JET RPTED A TA AND THEN RA. ATC THEN ASKED US TO STAY '2 MI' AND THEN 3 MI W OF THE FINAL. ATC'S INSTRUCTION TO 'REMAIN CLR OF THE APCH COURSE' WAS NOT SPECIFIC ENOUGH. WHAT WAS FINE FOR VFR SEPARATION OBVIOUSLY WAS NOT GOOD ENOUGH FOR TCASII. ATC NEEDS TO BE MORE SPECIFIC HERE AND SINCE DISTANCE IS HARD TO ESTIMATE PRECISELY TO AN INVISIBLE LINE (THE LOC), A DISTANCE MAY NOT BE ENOUGH. A VECTOR WORKS BETTER. ALSO, TCASII SEEMS TO CREATE PROBS WHEN NONE EXIST. THE JET HAD US IN SIGHT AND WE THEM. NEAREST DISTANCE WAS PROBABLY 1.5 MI HORIZ AND 500-1500 FT VERT, YET THE JET HAD TO CLB, LEADING TO A LESS STABLE DSCNT FOR HIM, AND A WIDE DIVERT AROUND THE LOC FOR US. DOES TCASII NEED TO ENFORCE IFR SEPARATION UNDER VFR CONDITIONS? PERHAPS IT'S A LIMITATION OF THE TECHNOLOGY, BUT IT DOES HAVE SAFETY (UNNEEDED GAR) AND EFFICIENCY IMPACTS ON OPS.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.