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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 519650 |
Time | |
Date | 200107 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Altitude | msl single value : 5000 |
Aircraft 1 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B777 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | descent : holding ground : preflight |
Route In Use | arrival other |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : saez.tracon |
Make Model Name | Any Unknown or Unlisted Aircraft Manufacturer |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain instruction : trainee |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : commercial pilot : multi engine pilot : instrument |
ASRS Report | 519650 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer instruction : instructor oversight : pic |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : published procedure non adherence : clearance other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : returned to original clearance |
Consequence | other |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Airspace Structure Aircraft ATC Human Performance Flight Crew Human Performance |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
I flew my first trip down to eze last week. On the way down, both the captain and experienced first officer remarked that eze approach almost always tells you what approach to use at the very last min. The first officer said they usually send you to arsot and have you hold, after which they give you an approach. Last week both the center and approach had told us that we were cleared to arsot. About 50 mi from arsot, approach then cleared us to the VOR. Everyone assumed that we would then be vectored for the approach. 5 mi from arsot, approach cleared us for approach #7 which I believe is the VOR to runway 11. Since we were approaching from the north, the captain put in the holding pattern so we could get aligned with the approach. Obviously, we had no time to brief or to plan, so it was a bit frantic getting ready. About 15 seconds after we turned east, approach called us and asked us what we were doing. The captain replied that we had entered the hold. Approach replied that we were 'not authority/authorized to do that' and we should begin the approach immediately as there was traffic right in front of us. Fortunately, we were VFR and we could see the traffic and turned back to the VOR to begin the approach. We completed the approach without incident, but it was high workload as we were still struggling to get everything set up. Not the smoothest way to do an approach on my IOE. My concerns are twofold: 1) why in the word does eze approach wait until the last second to assign an approach? That night at dinner the 2 other crews agreed that this is consistent down there. This is plain unsafe. 2) eze approach's failure to understand ICAO procedures. They were expecting us to turn west and begin the approach without being within 30 degrees of the outbound course. Either I am missing something, or this is both wrong and very dangerous. Had we not been VFR, the traffic would have been a factor as well.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A B777 CREW ARRIVING SAEZ, ENTERED A HOLD TO GET SET UP FOR THE APCH, CONTRARY TO ATC'S WISHES.
Narrative: I FLEW MY FIRST TRIP DOWN TO EZE LAST WK. ON THE WAY DOWN, BOTH THE CAPT AND EXPERIENCED FO REMARKED THAT EZE APCH ALMOST ALWAYS TELLS YOU WHAT APCH TO USE AT THE VERY LAST MIN. THE FO SAID THEY USUALLY SEND YOU TO ARSOT AND HAVE YOU HOLD, AFTER WHICH THEY GIVE YOU AN APCH. LAST WK BOTH THE CTR AND APCH HAD TOLD US THAT WE WERE CLRED TO ARSOT. ABOUT 50 MI FROM ARSOT, APCH THEN CLRED US TO THE VOR. EVERYONE ASSUMED THAT WE WOULD THEN BE VECTORED FOR THE APCH. 5 MI FROM ARSOT, APCH CLRED US FOR APCH #7 WHICH I BELIEVE IS THE VOR TO RWY 11. SINCE WE WERE APCHING FROM THE N, THE CAPT PUT IN THE HOLDING PATTERN SO WE COULD GET ALIGNED WITH THE APCH. OBVIOUSLY, WE HAD NO TIME TO BRIEF OR TO PLAN, SO IT WAS A BIT FRANTIC GETTING READY. ABOUT 15 SECONDS AFTER WE TURNED E, APCH CALLED US AND ASKED US WHAT WE WERE DOING. THE CAPT REPLIED THAT WE HAD ENTERED THE HOLD. APCH REPLIED THAT WE WERE 'NOT AUTH TO DO THAT' AND WE SHOULD BEGIN THE APCH IMMEDIATELY AS THERE WAS TFC RIGHT IN FRONT OF US. FORTUNATELY, WE WERE VFR AND WE COULD SEE THE TFC AND TURNED BACK TO THE VOR TO BEGIN THE APCH. WE COMPLETED THE APCH WITHOUT INCIDENT, BUT IT WAS HIGH WORKLOAD AS WE WERE STILL STRUGGLING TO GET EVERYTHING SET UP. NOT THE SMOOTHEST WAY TO DO AN APCH ON MY IOE. MY CONCERNS ARE TWOFOLD: 1) WHY IN THE WORD DOES EZE APCH WAIT UNTIL THE LAST SECOND TO ASSIGN AN APCH? THAT NIGHT AT DINNER THE 2 OTHER CREWS AGREED THAT THIS IS CONSISTENT DOWN THERE. THIS IS PLAIN UNSAFE. 2) EZE APCH'S FAILURE TO UNDERSTAND ICAO PROCS. THEY WERE EXPECTING US TO TURN W AND BEGIN THE APCH WITHOUT BEING WITHIN 30 DEGS OF THE OUTBOUND COURSE. EITHER I AM MISSING SOMETHING, OR THIS IS BOTH WRONG AND VERY DANGEROUS. HAD WE NOT BEEN VFR, THE TFC WOULD HAVE BEEN A FACTOR AS WELL.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.