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Potential conflict with a circling PA23 at 3500 ft noted by an airliner PIC inbound on V15, 40 NM out from hnl, hi.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 552927 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200207 |
| Day | Sat |
| Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | navaid : hnl.vortac |
| State Reference | HI |
| Altitude | msl single value : 3500 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : hnl.tracon |
| Operator | general aviation : instructional |
| Make Model Name | PA-23-250 Aztec |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
| Flight Phase | cruise other |
| Flight Plan | None |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : hnl.tracon |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | other |
| Function | instruction : instructor |
| Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : multi engine |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 112 flight time total : 510 flight time type : 121 |
| ASRS Report | 552927 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | other |
| Function | instruction : trainee |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | conflict : airborne critical non adherence : required legal separation non adherence : far non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | atc equipment other atc equipment : radar aircraft equipment : tcas other controllera other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
| Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | Flight Crew Human Performance Airspace Structure |
| Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
| Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
The student and I were maneuvering offshore well clear of class B and the victor airway printed on the sectional chart. We were making level turns to maintain altitude and clearance from class B and were going to call hnl approach and request practice approachs. We were heading southeast when I noticed the airliner off our right wing. He was heading southeast also. He was about 1 1/2 mi away and 1000 ft above us. When I saw the airliner off my wing, I told the student to turn to the left and bring us closer to the shoreline. I did not see the airliner until he was off of our wing and ahead of us and did not feel either aircraft was in jeopardy of a midair. On our way back to hnl, approach control asked us to call their office when we were back on the ground. I called approach and they informed me that the airliner thought we were too close. The airliner and approach control radar saw us. I explained that I thought all incoming hnl traffic were on V15 or south of it. The controller said they vector people closer to the shoreline, which I was unaware of. Perhaps the sectional chart should have a notice informing pilots of the increased traffic in that area, altitudes they're at, and typical flight paths they take since the chart does not specify any of that.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: POTENTIAL CONFLICT WITH A CIRCLING PA23 AT 3500 FT NOTED BY AN AIRLINER PIC INBOUND ON V15, 40 NM OUT FROM HNL, HI.
Narrative: THE STUDENT AND I WERE MANEUVERING OFFSHORE WELL CLR OF CLASS B AND THE VICTOR AIRWAY PRINTED ON THE SECTIONAL CHART. WE WERE MAKING LEVEL TURNS TO MAINTAIN ALT AND CLRNC FROM CLASS B AND WERE GOING TO CALL HNL APCH AND REQUEST PRACTICE APCHS. WE WERE HDG SE WHEN I NOTICED THE AIRLINER OFF OUR R WING. HE WAS HDG SE ALSO. HE WAS ABOUT 1 1/2 MI AWAY AND 1000 FT ABOVE US. WHEN I SAW THE AIRLINER OFF MY WING, I TOLD THE STUDENT TO TURN TO THE L AND BRING US CLOSER TO THE SHORELINE. I DID NOT SEE THE AIRLINER UNTIL HE WAS OFF OF OUR WING AND AHEAD OF US AND DID NOT FEEL EITHER ACFT WAS IN JEOPARDY OF A MIDAIR. ON OUR WAY BACK TO HNL, APCH CTL ASKED US TO CALL THEIR OFFICE WHEN WE WERE BACK ON THE GND. I CALLED APCH AND THEY INFORMED ME THAT THE AIRLINER THOUGHT WE WERE TOO CLOSE. THE AIRLINER AND APCH CTL RADAR SAW US. I EXPLAINED THAT I THOUGHT ALL INCOMING HNL TFC WERE ON V15 OR S OF IT. THE CTLR SAID THEY VECTOR PEOPLE CLOSER TO THE SHORELINE, WHICH I WAS UNAWARE OF. PERHAPS THE SECTIONAL CHART SHOULD HAVE A NOTICE INFORMING PLTS OF THE INCREASED TFC IN THAT AREA, ALTS THEY'RE AT, AND TYPICAL FLT PATHS THEY TAKE SINCE THE CHART DOES NOT SPECIFY ANY OF THAT.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.