CL65 flight crew encounters wake turbulence during approach to lax.

Attributes
ACN	564140
Time
Date	200210
Day	Wed
Local Time Of Day	1801 To 2400
Place
Locale Reference	airport : lax.airport
State Reference	CA
Altitude	msl single value : 2200
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Night
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : sct.tracon tower : lax.tower
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Regional Jet CL65, Undifferentiated or Other Model
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 121
Navigation In Use	ils localizer & glide slope : 24r other
Flight Phase	descent : approach
Route In Use	approach : instrument precision arrival : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Aircraft 2
Controlling Facilities	tower : lax.tower
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Commercial Fixed Wing
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 121
Flight Phase	descent : approach
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : multi engine pilot : cfi pilot : atp
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 150 flight time total : 5600 flight time type : 400
ASRS Report	564140
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : first officer
Events
Anomaly	inflight encounter : wake turbulence other anomaly
Independent Detector	other flight crewa other flight crewb
Resolutory Action	flight crew : regained aircraft control
Consequence	faa : reviewed incident with flight crew
Supplementary
Problem Areas	Aircraft Environmental Factor ATC Human Performance
Primary Problem	Environmental Factor

Narrative:

'Turn right 220 degrees, maintain 2200 ft, cleared ILS runway 24R.' we had been at 2500 ft, but ATC deferred us to 2200 ft MSL before clearing us for the approach. If we had been at 2500 ft, we would not have hit both air carrier airline's wingtip and/or flap vortexes which produces 2 distinct and rather violent roll inputs in both directions in under 2 seconds. Our autoplt corrected the first uncommanded roll, but the second opposite roll it could not handle and disconnected. I was about to disconnect the autoplt, but it beat me. Air carrier Y approach profiles are unacceptable towards industry safety. They fly fast and end up high, well above the glide path of the ILS. We cannot safely fly above their path to avoid their wake. So, we are stuck in a roulette situation. ATC failed to understand my in-flight report of 'roll upset.' yet they issue 'caution wake turbulence' out of practically every sentence they speak. They (ATC) clearly do not understand the daily threats I fly around in and out of lax in particular.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: CL65 FLC ENCOUNTERS WAKE TURB DURING APCH TO LAX.

Narrative: 'TURN R 220 DEGS, MAINTAIN 2200 FT, CLRED ILS RWY 24R.' WE HAD BEEN AT 2500 FT, BUT ATC DEFERRED US TO 2200 FT MSL BEFORE CLRING US FOR THE APCH. IF WE HAD BEEN AT 2500 FT, WE WOULD NOT HAVE HIT BOTH ACR AIRLINE'S WINGTIP AND/OR FLAP VORTEXES WHICH PRODUCES 2 DISTINCT AND RATHER VIOLENT ROLL INPUTS IN BOTH DIRECTIONS IN UNDER 2 SECONDS. OUR AUTOPLT CORRECTED THE FIRST UNCOMMANDED ROLL, BUT THE SECOND OPPOSITE ROLL IT COULD NOT HANDLE AND DISCONNECTED. I WAS ABOUT TO DISCONNECT THE AUTOPLT, BUT IT BEAT ME. ACR Y APCH PROFILES ARE UNACCEPTABLE TOWARDS INDUSTRY SAFETY. THEY FLY FAST AND END UP HIGH, WELL ABOVE THE GLIDE PATH OF THE ILS. WE CANNOT SAFELY FLY ABOVE THEIR PATH TO AVOID THEIR WAKE. SO, WE ARE STUCK IN A ROULETTE SIT. ATC FAILED TO UNDERSTAND MY INFLT RPT OF 'ROLL UPSET.' YET THEY ISSUE 'CAUTION WAKE TURB' OUT OF PRACTICALLY EVERY SENTENCE THEY SPEAK. THEY (ATC) CLRLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE DAILY THREATS I FLY AROUND IN AND OUT OF LAX IN PARTICULAR.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.