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LJ45 overtaking a DHC8 reports the aircraft in sight and is instructed by a ZTL controller to maintain visual separation while descending to a lower altitude.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 571122 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200301 |
| Day | Mon |
| Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | airport : gso.airport |
| State Reference | NC |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 13000 msl bound upper : 17000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Night |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : ztl.artcc |
| Operator | general aviation : corporate |
| Make Model Name | Learjet 45 |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
| Flight Phase | descent : approach descent : intermediate altitude |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | Dash 8 Series Undifferentiated or Other Model |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | descent : approach |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : corporate |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : cfi pilot : atp |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 90 flight time total : 6000 flight time type : 1000 |
| ASRS Report | 571122 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : corporate |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : required legal separation non adherence : published procedure non adherence : far |
| Independent Detector | atc equipment other atc equipment : radar aircraft equipment : tcas |
| Resolutory Action | controller : issued advisory flight crew : took evasive action |
| Miss Distance | horizontal : 1000 vertical : 1000 |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | Flight Crew Human Performance ATC Human Performance |
| Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Narrative:
Situation developed as my aircraft was asked to identify a dash 8 10-12 mi south of our position. Myself (PF) and the PNF both easily idented the aircraft's position and strobe lights. At this time, this controller told us the dash 8 was level 1000 ft below us (at 16000 ft) and cleared us to 'maintain visual separation with that traffic, descend and maintain 11000 ft.' I initiated a 2000 FPM rate of descent in vertical speed mode on the autoplt. Approximately 20 seconds into the maneuver, a crew member on the dash 8 notified ATC 'he was getting an RA,' but did not say he was following it. The controller responded that we had the dash 8 in sight, and we were visually descending through his altitude. Though I received a climb RA at this time, I was well below the dash 8's assigned altitude of 16000 ft and believed an increased rate of descent would be the best thing to do. Out of about 14000 ft, it became apparent the dash 8 was rapidly descending on a collision course with us. I disconnected the autoplt initiated a 45 degree bank to the left as the dash 8 passed by 3 O'clock high -- we will not be accepting night-time visual separation clrncs in the future.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: LJ45 OVERTAKING A DHC8 RPTS THE ACFT IN SIGHT AND IS INSTRUCTED BY A ZTL CTLR TO MAINTAIN VISUAL SEPARATION WHILE DSNDING TO A LOWER ALT.
Narrative: SIT DEVELOPED AS MY ACFT WAS ASKED TO IDENT A DASH 8 10-12 MI S OF OUR POS. MYSELF (PF) AND THE PNF BOTH EASILY IDENTED THE ACFT'S POS AND STROBE LIGHTS. AT THIS TIME, THIS CTLR TOLD US THE DASH 8 WAS LEVEL 1000 FT BELOW US (AT 16000 FT) AND CLRED US TO 'MAINTAIN VISUAL SEPARATION WITH THAT TFC, DSND AND MAINTAIN 11000 FT.' I INITIATED A 2000 FPM RATE OF DSCNT IN VERT SPD MODE ON THE AUTOPLT. APPROX 20 SECONDS INTO THE MANEUVER, A CREW MEMBER ON THE DASH 8 NOTIFIED ATC 'HE WAS GETTING AN RA,' BUT DID NOT SAY HE WAS FOLLOWING IT. THE CTLR RESPONDED THAT WE HAD THE DASH 8 IN SIGHT, AND WE WERE VISUALLY DSNDING THROUGH HIS ALT. THOUGH I RECEIVED A CLB RA AT THIS TIME, I WAS WELL BELOW THE DASH 8'S ASSIGNED ALT OF 16000 FT AND BELIEVED AN INCREASED RATE OF DSCNT WOULD BE THE BEST THING TO DO. OUT OF ABOUT 14000 FT, IT BECAME APPARENT THE DASH 8 WAS RAPIDLY DSNDING ON A COLLISION COURSE WITH US. I DISCONNECTED THE AUTOPLT INITIATED A 45 DEG BANK TO THE L AS THE DASH 8 PASSED BY 3 O'CLOCK HIGH -- WE WILL NOT BE ACCEPTING NIGHT-TIME VISUAL SEPARATION CLRNCS IN THE FUTURE.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.