37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 602120 |
Time | |
Date | 200312 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | navaid : lax.vortac |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl single value : 14000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : sct.tracon |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B737-700 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | arrival : on vectors arrival star : tandy |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 3600 flight time type : 650 |
ASRS Report | 602120 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 180 flight time total : 21000 flight time type : 15000 |
ASRS Report | 602123 |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa other flight crewb |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : returned to original clearance |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance Flight Crew Human Performance |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Narrative:
On descent to sna, we were on the arrival to the airport. At an altitude of approximately FL200, we were given a heading of 130 degrees to fly. A few mins later, approach or center said 'cross merma at 14000 ft.' approximately 15 mi to merma, still on the 130 degree heading, I inquired the captain if ATC still wanted us on the 130 degree heading or direct merma. The captain asked ATC. The response was that we were to 'cross merma at 14000 ft and should have been direct merma.' our 130 degree heading would put us 5 mi away from merma. I immediately initiated a turn to merma. We were level at 14000 ft at this point. The controller said to fly heading 160 degrees. Approximately 15 seconds later, the controller said to fly heading 170 degrees. We complied with both vectors. ATC handed us off to next controller. What we did wrong: 1) we should have clarified the 'cross merma at 14000 ft' by asking if they wanted us 'direct merma' also when we initially received clearance. 2) we should have queried ATC earlier in the descent regarding the 130 degree heading. What we did right: 1) we did notice the discrepancy, albeit not early enough, and queried the controller. 2) remained professional at all times. Not the time to change barbs over the radio. What I learned: double and triple check all clrncs. If they don't add up, ask!
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: B737 IN DSCNT FOR SNA IS GIVEN CONFUSING ATC INSTRUCTIONS DURING VECTORS.
Narrative: ON DSCNT TO SNA, WE WERE ON THE ARR TO THE ARPT. AT AN ALT OF APPROX FL200, WE WERE GIVEN A HEADING OF 130 DEGS TO FLY. A FEW MINS LATER, APCH OR CTR SAID 'CROSS MERMA AT 14000 FT.' APPROX 15 MI TO MERMA, STILL ON THE 130 DEG HDG, I INQUIRED THE CAPT IF ATC STILL WANTED US ON THE 130 DEG HDG OR DIRECT MERMA. THE CAPT ASKED ATC. THE RESPONSE WAS THAT WE WERE TO 'CROSS MERMA AT 14000 FT AND SHOULD HAVE BEEN DIRECT MERMA.' OUR 130 DEG HDG WOULD PUT US 5 MI AWAY FROM MERMA. I IMMEDIATELY INITIATED A TURN TO MERMA. WE WERE LEVEL AT 14000 FT AT THIS POINT. THE CTLR SAID TO FLY HEADING 160 DEGS. APPROX 15 SECONDS LATER, THE CTLR SAID TO FLY HEADING 170 DEGS. WE COMPLIED WITH BOTH VECTORS. ATC HANDED US OFF TO NEXT CTLR. WHAT WE DID WRONG: 1) WE SHOULD HAVE CLARIFIED THE 'CROSS MERMA AT 14000 FT' BY ASKING IF THEY WANTED US 'DIRECT MERMA' ALSO WHEN WE INITIALLY RECEIVED CLRNC. 2) WE SHOULD HAVE QUERIED ATC EARLIER IN THE DSCNT REGARDING THE 130 DEG HDG. WHAT WE DID RIGHT: 1) WE DID NOTICE THE DISCREPANCY, ALBEIT NOT EARLY ENOUGH, AND QUERIED THE CTLR. 2) REMAINED PROFESSIONAL AT ALL TIMES. NOT THE TIME TO CHANGE BARBS OVER THE RADIO. WHAT I LEARNED: DOUBLE AND TRIPLE CHK ALL CLRNCS. IF THEY DON'T ADD UP, ASK!
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.