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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 609178 |
Time | |
Date | 200402 |
Day | Sat |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | navaid : bkw.vortac |
State Reference | WV |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 33000 msl bound upper : 33500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zid.artcc tower : bhm.tower |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | MD-88 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | other |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : flight engineer pilot : instrument pilot : multi engine pilot : atp pilot : commercial |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 165 flight time total : 9000 flight time type : 5000 |
ASRS Report | 609178 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : flight engineer pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 150 flight time total : 8000 flight time type : 2400 |
ASRS Report | 609014 |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne critical non adherence : clearance non adherence : required legal separation |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment : tcas other flight crewa other flight crewb |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance flight crew : returned to original clearance flight crew : took evasive action |
Consequence | faa : investigated |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 24000 vertical : 400 |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance Aircraft |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Operational Error |
Narrative:
On a vector at FL330 for traffic when ATC asked if we could climb to FL350. We said yes, were given clearance to FL350. We acknowledged the clearance. Then ATC said we needed to be at FL350 in 1 1/2 mins. We responded with 'we will do the best we can.' ATC then gave us a right turn. We read back the turn and told ATC we would not make the restr. We got a TA on TCASII that went to RA. TCASII instructed a climb so I as PF sacrificed airspeed and increased the rate of climb. We were at FL335. At that time ATC asked if we were at FL350. We responded 'no' and repeated that we told them we were not able to make the restr. No response from ATC. PA terminated. Vectored back on course. Supplemental information from acn 609014: in cruise at FL330, we were given a 40 degree left turn for traffic. 20-30 seconds later, we were given a turn 30 degrees right. After 10 seconds later, when it was apparent the turn had killed our climb rate, we told them we would be unable to make FL350 in the time he requested, we were given a further turn. I think one way a situation like this could be avoided is by the controller asking if you will be able to meet any type of performance criteria he has before issuing a clearance. When clearance is issued with stipulations, by the time a pilot realizes he is unable to comply, radio congestion may negate his ability to communicate that information to the controller in a timely manner.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: MD88 AT FL330 EXPERIENCED TCASII RA WHILE ON ATC VECTORS AND CLBING TO FL350.
Narrative: ON A VECTOR AT FL330 FOR TFC WHEN ATC ASKED IF WE COULD CLB TO FL350. WE SAID YES, WERE GIVEN CLRNC TO FL350. WE ACKNOWLEDGED THE CLRNC. THEN ATC SAID WE NEEDED TO BE AT FL350 IN 1 1/2 MINS. WE RESPONDED WITH 'WE WILL DO THE BEST WE CAN.' ATC THEN GAVE US A R TURN. WE READ BACK THE TURN AND TOLD ATC WE WOULD NOT MAKE THE RESTR. WE GOT A TA ON TCASII THAT WENT TO RA. TCASII INSTRUCTED A CLB SO I AS PF SACRIFICED AIRSPD AND INCREASED THE RATE OF CLB. WE WERE AT FL335. AT THAT TIME ATC ASKED IF WE WERE AT FL350. WE RESPONDED 'NO' AND REPEATED THAT WE TOLD THEM WE WERE NOT ABLE TO MAKE THE RESTR. NO RESPONSE FROM ATC. PA TERMINATED. VECTORED BACK ON COURSE. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 609014: IN CRUISE AT FL330, WE WERE GIVEN A 40 DEG L TURN FOR TFC. 20-30 SECONDS LATER, WE WERE GIVEN A TURN 30 DEGS R. AFTER 10 SECONDS LATER, WHEN IT WAS APPARENT THE TURN HAD KILLED OUR CLB RATE, WE TOLD THEM WE WOULD BE UNABLE TO MAKE FL350 IN THE TIME HE REQUESTED, WE WERE GIVEN A FURTHER TURN. I THINK ONE WAY A SIT LIKE THIS COULD BE AVOIDED IS BY THE CTLR ASKING IF YOU WILL BE ABLE TO MEET ANY TYPE OF PERFORMANCE CRITERIA HE HAS BEFORE ISSUING A CLRNC. WHEN CLRNC IS ISSUED WITH STIPULATIONS, BY THE TIME A PLT REALIZES HE IS UNABLE TO COMPLY, RADIO CONGESTION MAY NEGATE HIS ABILITY TO COMMUNICATE THAT INFO TO THE CTLR IN A TIMELY MANNER.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.