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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 609640 |
Time | |
Date | 200402 |
Day | Tue |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | navaid : pie.vortac |
State Reference | FL |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 5000 msl bound upper : 6000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | IMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : tpa.tracon |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | A320 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | other |
Flight Phase | descent : holding |
Route In Use | arrival : holding pattern |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi pilot : commercial pilot : flight engineer pilot : multi engine pilot : instrument |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 18000 flight time type : 6000 |
ASRS Report | 609640 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Events | |
Anomaly | inflight encounter : weather non adherence : published procedure other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance controller : issued advisory flight crew : returned to intended or assigned course |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance Flight Crew Human Performance Weather |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Narrative:
We requested holding at pie VOR to delay landing due to level 3 thunderstorm on tpa airport from south to north. Controller initially denied request to hold at pie. Then he said, 'alright, hold west of pie on the 260 degree radial within 5-15 mi, maintain 5000 ft.' I read back the clearance verbatim and commenced holding entry. The controller queried us as to what we were doing. He climbed us to 6000 ft immediately. He kept saying 260 degree radial is west. That is how we set up the hold and reported entering holding at pie at 6000 ft. The controller never could understand why we were not farther west. We thought he wanted us to hold at pie within 5-15 mi west on 260 degrees. I believe after the fact he meant us to hold at the pie 260 degrees at about 5-15 mi fix, holding west of that fix. Had he said, hold west of the pie 260 degrees at 10 DME fix on the 260 degree radial, we would have understood the clearance. Non-standard ATC phraseology and improper holding clearance caused this problem. We were subsequently vectored around for landing. Maintaining professional, standard, correct ATC phraseology and procedures would have prevented this occurrence.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: CLRED INTO HOLDING AT PIE VOR BY TPA APCH DUE TO WX, A320 FLT CREW EXECUTE HOLDING OTHER THAN THE CTLR EXPECTED.
Narrative: WE REQUESTED HOLDING AT PIE VOR TO DELAY LNDG DUE TO LEVEL 3 TSTM ON TPA ARPT FROM S TO N. CTLR INITIALLY DENIED REQUEST TO HOLD AT PIE. THEN HE SAID, 'ALRIGHT, HOLD W OF PIE ON THE 260 DEG RADIAL WITHIN 5-15 MI, MAINTAIN 5000 FT.' I READ BACK THE CLRNC VERBATIM AND COMMENCED HOLDING ENTRY. THE CTLR QUERIED US AS TO WHAT WE WERE DOING. HE CLBED US TO 6000 FT IMMEDIATELY. HE KEPT SAYING 260 DEG RADIAL IS W. THAT IS HOW WE SET UP THE HOLD AND RPTED ENTERING HOLDING AT PIE AT 6000 FT. THE CTLR NEVER COULD UNDERSTAND WHY WE WERE NOT FARTHER W. WE THOUGHT HE WANTED US TO HOLD AT PIE WITHIN 5-15 MI W ON 260 DEGS. I BELIEVE AFTER THE FACT HE MEANT US TO HOLD AT THE PIE 260 DEGS AT ABOUT 5-15 MI FIX, HOLDING W OF THAT FIX. HAD HE SAID, HOLD W OF THE PIE 260 DEGS AT 10 DME FIX ON THE 260 DEG RADIAL, WE WOULD HAVE UNDERSTOOD THE CLRNC. NON-STANDARD ATC PHRASEOLOGY AND IMPROPER HOLDING CLRNC CAUSED THIS PROB. WE WERE SUBSEQUENTLY VECTORED AROUND FOR LNDG. MAINTAINING PROFESSIONAL, STANDARD, CORRECT ATC PHRASEOLOGY AND PROCS WOULD HAVE PREVENTED THIS OCCURRENCE.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.