Narrative:

The crew operated the aircraft as dictated in the company's published procedures and consistent with the past practice of operating in the ord approach environment. The practice of joining the GS from above certainly is consistent with the published operating rules but for the last 21 yrs we have been joining the GS upon intercept at ord and that is what I thought they expected. Ord ATC was in a west flow using simultaneous arrs to runways 27R and 28. The flight was cleared for the approach maintain 5000 ft to wavie. The flight guidance controller was armed for the approach mode as the aircraft was established inbound. When the GS captured the aircraft departed 5000 ft and followed the GS beam. The approach was completed normally. After landing the ord tower requested that I call the approach control in elgin. I spoke with a supervisor who advised me that they showed the aircraft to be 300 ft low over wavie. He indicated that there was no loss of separation but that they had shown an altitude deviation. He also indicated that it is the intention of ord ATC that we join the GS from above after wavie. He indicated that this was an intentional change requested by ord ATC when the new runway 28 ILS procedure was designed. He also indicated that this was a recurring problem with multiple airlines and please advise the pilots of what ord ATC intended and was expecting. Failure to maintain 5000 ft till past wavie and above the GS could result in a loss of separation. Request from the ord tower to call the approach control facility. I must say the facility was very professional and indicated that they only wanted to see a change in how we operated on the ILS runway 28. 1) spoke with an ATC supervisor as requested by the tower. 2) notified my domicile chief pilot of the ord facility's desire for to join the approach from above not on GS intercept. 3) completed a report to ensure the facility's concern is available for dissemination. 4) consider review of the appropriate time to select approach mode on the flight guidance controller when cleared for an approach in the aom 1 procedures. Consider if the geographic location of wavie at a position above the GS beam is the best location.

Related reports:

Google
 

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: AN ACR PILOT REPORTS ORD TRACON REQUIRING ACFT CROSS WAVIE INTXN ON THE RWY 28 ILS/LOC AT 5000 FT TO PREVENT CONFLICT WITH ACFT ON APCH TO 27 AT 4000 FT.

Narrative: THE CREW OPERATED THE ACFT AS DICTATED IN THE COMPANY'S PUBLISHED PROCS AND CONSISTENT WITH THE PAST PRACTICE OF OPERATING IN THE ORD APCH ENVIRONMENT. THE PRACTICE OF JOINING THE GS FROM ABOVE CERTAINLY IS CONSISTENT WITH THE PUBLISHED OPERATING RULES BUT FOR THE LAST 21 YRS WE HAVE BEEN JOINING THE GS UPON INTERCEPT AT ORD AND THAT IS WHAT I THOUGHT THEY EXPECTED. ORD ATC WAS IN A W FLOW USING SIMULTANEOUS ARRS TO RWYS 27R AND 28. THE FLT WAS CLRED FOR THE APCH MAINTAIN 5000 FT TO WAVIE. THE FLT GUIDANCE CTLR WAS ARMED FOR THE APCH MODE AS THE ACFT WAS ESTABLISHED INBOUND. WHEN THE GS CAPTURED THE ACFT DEPARTED 5000 FT AND FOLLOWED THE GS BEAM. THE APCH WAS COMPLETED NORMALLY. AFTER LNDG THE ORD TWR REQUESTED THAT I CALL THE APCH CTL IN ELGIN. I SPOKE WITH A SUPVR WHO ADVISED ME THAT THEY SHOWED THE ACFT TO BE 300 FT LOW OVER WAVIE. HE INDICATED THAT THERE WAS NO LOSS OF SEPARATION BUT THAT THEY HAD SHOWN AN ALTDEV. HE ALSO INDICATED THAT IT IS THE INTENTION OF ORD ATC THAT WE JOIN THE GS FROM ABOVE AFTER WAVIE. HE INDICATED THAT THIS WAS AN INTENTIONAL CHANGE REQUESTED BY ORD ATC WHEN THE NEW RWY 28 ILS PROC WAS DESIGNED. HE ALSO INDICATED THAT THIS WAS A RECURRING PROB WITH MULTIPLE AIRLINES AND PLEASE ADVISE THE PLTS OF WHAT ORD ATC INTENDED AND WAS EXPECTING. FAILURE TO MAINTAIN 5000 FT TILL PAST WAVIE AND ABOVE THE GS COULD RESULT IN A LOSS OF SEPARATION. REQUEST FROM THE ORD TWR TO CALL THE APCH CTL FACILITY. I MUST SAY THE FACILITY WAS VERY PROFESSIONAL AND INDICATED THAT THEY ONLY WANTED TO SEE A CHANGE IN HOW WE OPERATED ON THE ILS RWY 28. 1) SPOKE WITH AN ATC SUPVR AS REQUESTED BY THE TWR. 2) NOTIFIED MY DOMICILE CHIEF PLT OF THE ORD FACILITY'S DESIRE FOR TO JOIN THE APCH FROM ABOVE NOT ON GS INTERCEPT. 3) COMPLETED A RPT TO ENSURE THE FACILITY'S CONCERN IS AVAILABLE FOR DISSEMINATION. 4) CONSIDER REVIEW OF THE APPROPRIATE TIME TO SELECT APCH MODE ON THE FLT GUIDANCE CTLR WHEN CLRED FOR AN APCH IN THE AOM 1 PROCS. CONSIDER IF THE GEOGRAPHIC LOCATION OF WAVIE AT A POS ABOVE THE GS BEAM IS THE BEST LOCATION.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.