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37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
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Attributes | |
ACN | 748101 |
Time | |
Date | 200707 |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : slk.airport |
State Reference | NY |
Altitude | msl single value : 8000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | Mixed |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zbw.artcc |
Operator | general aviation : personal |
Make Model Name | Falcon 50 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Navigation In Use | other |
Flight Phase | descent : holding |
Route In Use | approach : instrument precision |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | other |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 60 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 520 |
ASRS Report | 748101 |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Facility ATC Human Performance |
Primary Problem | ATC Facility |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | communication equipment : zbw.artcc |
Narrative:
On descent into slk we were cleared direct to briel for the ILS runway 23 at slk. There was an aircraft ahead and behind on the approach as well. There were cells in the area and the only communication between boston center and all three aircraft was via relay from other airborne aircraft for clearances and cancellations of IFR clearances. We were cleared direct to briel and to hold as published for approach clearance delay for the prior aircraft to complete their approach. Briel is an IAF but has no published hold on it. Communication fell to none and we stayed on the published IAP at assigned altitude. The copilot queried center about our clearance and in broken transmissions in and out we thought we were given an approach clearance but were trying to verify it to no avail. Eventually it came through and we were given cross briel at 7000 ft cleared for the full approach. We flew the full IAP with no event and cancelled through another aircraft after about four attempts. Two main issues: the communication facility in the area at 8000 ft MSL and below seems less than adequate and extremely cumbersome for arrival and departure clearances. Briel has no hold published on the IAP plate for the ILS runway 23. Slk VOR does and one could only assume that we should have been cleared to slk for the hold. In retrospect; if faced with this same situation; I would attempt to attain communication to obtain a vector out of this area until positive communication and clearance could be received. I would love to see a remote comm link installed for direct communications to boston center eliminating the need to have VOR/VHF utilized for clearance.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: DA50 CAPTAIN REPORTS COMMUNICATIONS DIFFICULTIES AND QUESTIONABLE HOLDING CLEARANCE FROM ZBW CENTER DURING ILS RWY 23 APPROACH TO SLK.
Narrative: ON DESCENT INTO SLK WE WERE CLEARED DIRECT TO BRIEL FOR THE ILS RWY 23 AT SLK. THERE WAS AN AIRCRAFT AHEAD AND BEHIND ON THE APPROACH AS WELL. THERE WERE CELLS IN THE AREA AND THE ONLY COMMUNICATION BETWEEN BOSTON CENTER AND ALL THREE AIRCRAFT WAS VIA RELAY FROM OTHER AIRBORNE AIRCRAFT FOR CLEARANCES AND CANCELLATIONS OF IFR CLEARANCES. WE WERE CLEARED DIRECT TO BRIEL AND TO HOLD AS PUBLISHED FOR APPROACH CLEARANCE DELAY FOR THE PRIOR AIRCRAFT TO COMPLETE THEIR APPROACH. BRIEL IS AN IAF BUT HAS NO PUBLISHED HOLD ON IT. COMMUNICATION FELL TO NONE AND WE STAYED ON THE PUBLISHED IAP AT ASSIGNED ALTITUDE. THE COPILOT QUERIED CENTER ABOUT OUR CLEARANCE AND IN BROKEN TRANSMISSIONS IN AND OUT WE THOUGHT WE WERE GIVEN AN APPROACH CLEARANCE BUT WERE TRYING TO VERIFY IT TO NO AVAIL. EVENTUALLY IT CAME THROUGH AND WE WERE GIVEN CROSS BRIEL AT 7000 FT CLEARED FOR THE FULL APPROACH. WE FLEW THE FULL IAP WITH NO EVENT AND CANCELLED THROUGH ANOTHER AIRCRAFT AFTER ABOUT FOUR ATTEMPTS. TWO MAIN ISSUES: THE COMMUNICATION FACILITY IN THE AREA AT 8000 FT MSL AND BELOW SEEMS LESS THAN ADEQUATE AND EXTREMELY CUMBERSOME FOR ARRIVAL AND DEPARTURE CLEARANCES. BRIEL HAS NO HOLD PUBLISHED ON THE IAP PLATE FOR THE ILS RWY 23. SLK VOR DOES AND ONE COULD ONLY ASSUME THAT WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN CLEARED TO SLK FOR THE HOLD. IN RETROSPECT; IF FACED WITH THIS SAME SITUATION; I WOULD ATTEMPT TO ATTAIN COMMUNICATION TO OBTAIN A VECTOR OUT OF THIS AREA UNTIL POSITIVE COMMUNICATION AND CLEARANCE COULD BE RECEIVED. I WOULD LOVE TO SEE A REMOTE COMM LINK INSTALLED FOR DIRECT COMMUNICATIONS TO BOSTON CENTER ELIMINATING THE NEED TO HAVE VOR/VHF UTILIZED FOR CLEARANCE.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.