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Attributes | |
ACN | 759950 |
Time | |
Date | 200711 |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : zzz.airport |
State Reference | US |
Altitude | msl single value : 7500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Operator | general aviation : personal |
Make Model Name | Small Aircraft Low Wing 1 Eng Fixed Gear |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Flight Phase | descent : vacating altitude |
Flight Plan | None |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | other |
Make Model Name | Bronco |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Flight Phase | cruise other |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | other |
Function | flight crew : single pilot |
Qualification | pilot : private |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 38 flight time total : 859 flight time type : 504 |
ASRS Report | 759950 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | government other |
Function | flight crew : single pilot |
Events | |
Anomaly | airspace violation : entry conflict : airborne less severe |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : insufficient time |
Consequence | other |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Airspace Structure Flight Crew Human Performance |
Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
Narrative:
Prior to the event I got a briefing from the FSS; and carefully copied and plotted out the limits of the many fire tfr's that are in effect. I discussed with the briefer a route east that stayed clear of them. I also printed out the graphic tfr's and put them on my kneeboard. The point of this is that I am a very conscientious flyer with great respect for restr areas. I flew from ZZZ to ZZZ1 airport. Before I left I again called the FSS; during which I asked the specific question 'are the tfr's still in effect and are there any changes.' I was advised that they were still in effect. So I plotted a route at an altitude that would clear all of the tfr's; 8500 ft MSL. That call should be on record. After clearing the tfr; whose top was 7500 ft; north of mt X I started a slow descent to ZZZ1. During my descent an aircraft with twin tails and a high elevator; flew across in front of me. Then I noticed that they were making a rather steep turn and to my surprise coming back toward me. Although a collision was not imminent I felt it necessary to dive and turn to increase separation; then resumed my normal descent. Next I heard the aircraft passing overhead; and looked out my right window to see that they had passed only about 100 ft above me. At this point I became seriously concerned about my safety. I felt the turbulence from it rocking my aircraft. They did not attempt to call me and I had no idea what frequency they were on. Next it came up on my left side; taking position 100 ft or less from my left wingtip. It stayed there for a min or so during which I was trying to decide if it was safe to maneuver to get away from them; and I clearly saw 3 people onboard; one of them taking pictures. Still very concerned I held steady; then descended further hoping that they would go away. At about 4 mi from the airport when I announced that I was entering the traffic pattern for landing; a voice came up and without identing themselves; asked 'aircraft landing at ZZZ1; what are your numbers?' I provided them and asked why they had flown so close. Instead of answering they said 'you just flew right through a fire tfr.' I was sure that I had not and said so; suggesting that they check their own position; as I had the printout right in front of me. I could only speculate that they had assumed I had come through it rather than over it; and a radar track will show that it was well over. Their last transmission was a mumbled 'tell it to the FAA' or 'we have the FAA' (on board?). While I suppose that the fire pilots are good at what they do near the ground; this was clearly not safe behavior; and a very definite violation of far 91.111 'operating near other aircraft.' I understand that there are exceptions; such as homeland security and cbp; but I do not believe that the FAA has granted such authority/authorized to state owned public aircraft. In any case their status as public aircraft does not excuse unsafe flying. Apparently all of this was just to read my numbers. Conclusion: I suggest that the pilot of this aircraft; be required a refresher regarding far 91.111 and aim 7-3-9; and keep their 'cowboy' type of flying for fighting fires; and well away from NAS traffic. I suspect the excitement of the fires had their adrenalin going and they were just a little overzealous. While their mission is very important they need to be reminded that it does not excuse unsafe flying; and they are obligated to the same far's and safe flight behaviors as the rest of us. I regret that I did not get their aircraft number or other information. If they believed that I had violated a tfr they had 3 choices; 1) ask me; 2) follow me to the airport; only mins away; where I would have been glad to discuss it with them; and 3) fly close enough to read my numbers. They chose the most dangerous of the 3 choices. If I clipped the corner of the tfr on my descent it was definitely unintentional; and certainly not significantly. No danger or conflict with other aircraft existed until the other aircraft turned back and began maneuvering around me. The purpose of the tfr is to increase safety; not be an excuse to create an unsafe situation.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: GA PILOT IS INTERCEPTED BY CDF AND TOLD THAT HE HAS ENTERED A FIRE TFR. GA PILOT BELIEVES HE HAS NOT.
Narrative: PRIOR TO THE EVENT I GOT A BRIEFING FROM THE FSS; AND CAREFULLY COPIED AND PLOTTED OUT THE LIMITS OF THE MANY FIRE TFR'S THAT ARE IN EFFECT. I DISCUSSED WITH THE BRIEFER A RTE E THAT STAYED CLR OF THEM. I ALSO PRINTED OUT THE GRAPHIC TFR'S AND PUT THEM ON MY KNEEBOARD. THE POINT OF THIS IS THAT I AM A VERY CONSCIENTIOUS FLYER WITH GREAT RESPECT FOR RESTR AREAS. I FLEW FROM ZZZ TO ZZZ1 ARPT. BEFORE I LEFT I AGAIN CALLED THE FSS; DURING WHICH I ASKED THE SPECIFIC QUESTION 'ARE THE TFR'S STILL IN EFFECT AND ARE THERE ANY CHANGES.' I WAS ADVISED THAT THEY WERE STILL IN EFFECT. SO I PLOTTED A RTE AT AN ALT THAT WOULD CLR ALL OF THE TFR'S; 8500 FT MSL. THAT CALL SHOULD BE ON RECORD. AFTER CLRING THE TFR; WHOSE TOP WAS 7500 FT; N OF MT X I STARTED A SLOW DSCNT TO ZZZ1. DURING MY DSCNT AN ACFT WITH TWIN TAILS AND A HIGH ELEVATOR; FLEW ACROSS IN FRONT OF ME. THEN I NOTICED THAT THEY WERE MAKING A RATHER STEEP TURN AND TO MY SURPRISE COMING BACK TOWARD ME. ALTHOUGH A COLLISION WAS NOT IMMINENT I FELT IT NECESSARY TO DIVE AND TURN TO INCREASE SEPARATION; THEN RESUMED MY NORMAL DSCNT. NEXT I HEARD THE ACFT PASSING OVERHEAD; AND LOOKED OUT MY R WINDOW TO SEE THAT THEY HAD PASSED ONLY ABOUT 100 FT ABOVE ME. AT THIS POINT I BECAME SERIOUSLY CONCERNED ABOUT MY SAFETY. I FELT THE TURB FROM IT ROCKING MY ACFT. THEY DID NOT ATTEMPT TO CALL ME AND I HAD NO IDEA WHAT FREQ THEY WERE ON. NEXT IT CAME UP ON MY L SIDE; TAKING POS 100 FT OR LESS FROM MY L WINGTIP. IT STAYED THERE FOR A MIN OR SO DURING WHICH I WAS TRYING TO DECIDE IF IT WAS SAFE TO MANEUVER TO GET AWAY FROM THEM; AND I CLRLY SAW 3 PEOPLE ONBOARD; ONE OF THEM TAKING PICTURES. STILL VERY CONCERNED I HELD STEADY; THEN DSNDED FURTHER HOPING THAT THEY WOULD GO AWAY. AT ABOUT 4 MI FROM THE ARPT WHEN I ANNOUNCED THAT I WAS ENTERING THE TFC PATTERN FOR LNDG; A VOICE CAME UP AND WITHOUT IDENTING THEMSELVES; ASKED 'ACFT LNDG AT ZZZ1; WHAT ARE YOUR NUMBERS?' I PROVIDED THEM AND ASKED WHY THEY HAD FLOWN SO CLOSE. INSTEAD OF ANSWERING THEY SAID 'YOU JUST FLEW RIGHT THROUGH A FIRE TFR.' I WAS SURE THAT I HAD NOT AND SAID SO; SUGGESTING THAT THEY CHK THEIR OWN POS; AS I HAD THE PRINTOUT RIGHT IN FRONT OF ME. I COULD ONLY SPECULATE THAT THEY HAD ASSUMED I HAD COME THROUGH IT RATHER THAN OVER IT; AND A RADAR TRACK WILL SHOW THAT IT WAS WELL OVER. THEIR LAST XMISSION WAS A MUMBLED 'TELL IT TO THE FAA' OR 'WE HAVE THE FAA' (ON BOARD?). WHILE I SUPPOSE THAT THE FIRE PLTS ARE GOOD AT WHAT THEY DO NEAR THE GND; THIS WAS CLRLY NOT SAFE BEHAVIOR; AND A VERY DEFINITE VIOLATION OF FAR 91.111 'OPERATING NEAR OTHER ACFT.' I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS; SUCH AS HOMELAND SECURITY AND CBP; BUT I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THE FAA HAS GRANTED SUCH AUTH TO STATE OWNED PUBLIC ACFT. IN ANY CASE THEIR STATUS AS PUBLIC ACFT DOES NOT EXCUSE UNSAFE FLYING. APPARENTLY ALL OF THIS WAS JUST TO READ MY NUMBERS. CONCLUSION: I SUGGEST THAT THE PLT OF THIS ACFT; BE REQUIRED A REFRESHER REGARDING FAR 91.111 AND AIM 7-3-9; AND KEEP THEIR 'COWBOY' TYPE OF FLYING FOR FIGHTING FIRES; AND WELL AWAY FROM NAS TFC. I SUSPECT THE EXCITEMENT OF THE FIRES HAD THEIR ADRENALIN GOING AND THEY WERE JUST A LITTLE OVERZEALOUS. WHILE THEIR MISSION IS VERY IMPORTANT THEY NEED TO BE REMINDED THAT IT DOES NOT EXCUSE UNSAFE FLYING; AND THEY ARE OBLIGATED TO THE SAME FAR'S AND SAFE FLT BEHAVIORS AS THE REST OF US. I REGRET THAT I DID NOT GET THEIR ACFT NUMBER OR OTHER INFO. IF THEY BELIEVED THAT I HAD VIOLATED A TFR THEY HAD 3 CHOICES; 1) ASK ME; 2) FOLLOW ME TO THE ARPT; ONLY MINS AWAY; WHERE I WOULD HAVE BEEN GLAD TO DISCUSS IT WITH THEM; AND 3) FLY CLOSE ENOUGH TO READ MY NUMBERS. THEY CHOSE THE MOST DANGEROUS OF THE 3 CHOICES. IF I CLIPPED THE CORNER OF THE TFR ON MY DSCNT IT WAS DEFINITELY UNINTENTIONAL; AND CERTAINLY NOT SIGNIFICANTLY. NO DANGER OR CONFLICT WITH OTHER ACFT EXISTED UNTIL THE OTHER ACFT TURNED BACK AND BEGAN MANEUVERING AROUND ME. THE PURPOSE OF THE TFR IS TO INCREASE SAFETY; NOT BE AN EXCUSE TO CREATE AN UNSAFE SITUATION.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.