37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 775939 |
Time | |
Date | 200802 |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : atl.airport |
State Reference | GA |
Altitude | msl single value : 12000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | Marginal |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : a80.tracon |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Regional Jet CL65 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | arrival star : pechy |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 80 flight time total : 3800 flight time type : 2300 |
ASRS Report | 775939 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | government : faa |
Function | controller : approach |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : crossing restriction not met non adherence : published procedure |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | none taken : unable |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Aircraft Flight Crew Human Performance Chart Or Publication |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Narrative:
We were given the clearance to 'descend via' the pechy RNAV arrival. Upon being given the clearance we promptly briefed the arrival including verifying that the correct information was in the FMS. We also discussed how best to execute this as it was my first time doing this arrival with the 'descend via' clearance. I started the descent over what the aircraft was telling us was the doevr intersection which has a restr requiring it be crossed at 12000 ft and 210 KTS. As I started the descent I noticed that in order to make the following restrs at the assigned speeds per ATC; I had to dial in a very rapid rate of descent; which I promptly did. Descending out of 10700 ft approach queried our altitude saying he showed that we should still be at 12000 ft. We told him we had already crossed the waypoint. Nothing further was said about this; however the frequency was extremely busy as there were multiple aircraft checking in; speed changes being given different from the arrival instructions; and handoffs to the next frequency with the advisory to expect a short approach. I believe there were a series of events that led to the misunderstanding. The first being that this was my first time to execute the 'descend via' arrival and understanding what the best way to set up the automation to give me the appropriate guidance would be. Secondly; as we were briefing the arrival we were given alternate speed instructions different from the 'descend via' clearance adding to the confusion and workload. Thirdly; our aircraft treats the intxns as 'fly-by' waypoints meaning that it does not fly directly over the waypoint before turning to the next course (it leads the turn). By doing this it looks like (on the FMS distance) the aircraft has already passed the intersection when indeed on a radar scope it has not; but is merely flying by it. When adding this to the steep vertical descent speed that I dialed in; the information the controller saw was different from what we saw. Since this event; I have allowed the aircraft to finish the turn and become completely established on the new course before dialing in the descent.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: CL65 FLT CRW IS QUERIED BY ATC FOR APPARENTLY EARLY DESCENT PASSING DOEVR WAYPOINT ON THE PECHY RNAV STAR TO ATL.
Narrative: WE WERE GIVEN THE CLRNC TO 'DSND VIA' THE PECHY RNAV ARR. UPON BEING GIVEN THE CLRNC WE PROMPTLY BRIEFED THE ARR INCLUDING VERIFYING THAT THE CORRECT INFO WAS IN THE FMS. WE ALSO DISCUSSED HOW BEST TO EXECUTE THIS AS IT WAS MY FIRST TIME DOING THIS ARR WITH THE 'DSND VIA' CLRNC. I STARTED THE DSCNT OVER WHAT THE ACFT WAS TELLING US WAS THE DOEVR INTXN WHICH HAS A RESTR REQUIRING IT BE CROSSED AT 12000 FT AND 210 KTS. AS I STARTED THE DSCNT I NOTICED THAT IN ORDER TO MAKE THE FOLLOWING RESTRS AT THE ASSIGNED SPDS PER ATC; I HAD TO DIAL IN A VERY RAPID RATE OF DSCNT; WHICH I PROMPTLY DID. DSNDING OUT OF 10700 FT APCH QUERIED OUR ALT SAYING HE SHOWED THAT WE SHOULD STILL BE AT 12000 FT. WE TOLD HIM WE HAD ALREADY CROSSED THE WAYPOINT. NOTHING FURTHER WAS SAID ABOUT THIS; HOWEVER THE FREQ WAS EXTREMELY BUSY AS THERE WERE MULTIPLE ACFT CHKING IN; SPD CHANGES BEING GIVEN DIFFERENT FROM THE ARR INSTRUCTIONS; AND HDOFS TO THE NEXT FREQ WITH THE ADVISORY TO EXPECT A SHORT APCH. I BELIEVE THERE WERE A SERIES OF EVENTS THAT LED TO THE MISUNDERSTANDING. THE FIRST BEING THAT THIS WAS MY FIRST TIME TO EXECUTE THE 'DSND VIA' ARR AND UNDERSTANDING WHAT THE BEST WAY TO SET UP THE AUTOMATION TO GIVE ME THE APPROPRIATE GUIDANCE WOULD BE. SECONDLY; AS WE WERE BRIEFING THE ARR WE WERE GIVEN ALTERNATE SPD INSTRUCTIONS DIFFERENT FROM THE 'DSND VIA' CLRNC ADDING TO THE CONFUSION AND WORKLOAD. THIRDLY; OUR ACFT TREATS THE INTXNS AS 'FLY-BY' WAYPOINTS MEANING THAT IT DOES NOT FLY DIRECTLY OVER THE WAYPOINT BEFORE TURNING TO THE NEXT COURSE (IT LEADS THE TURN). BY DOING THIS IT LOOKS LIKE (ON THE FMS DISTANCE) THE ACFT HAS ALREADY PASSED THE INTXN WHEN INDEED ON A RADAR SCOPE IT HAS NOT; BUT IS MERELY FLYING BY IT. WHEN ADDING THIS TO THE STEEP VERT DSCNT SPD THAT I DIALED IN; THE INFO THE CTLR SAW WAS DIFFERENT FROM WHAT WE SAW. SINCE THIS EVENT; I HAVE ALLOWED THE ACFT TO FINISH THE TURN AND BECOME COMPLETELY ESTABLISHED ON THE NEW COURSE BEFORE DIALING IN THE DSCNT.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of May 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.