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A B737 pilot comments that during a slc FMS RNAV arrival runway change waypoints with altitude constraints were dropped that must be flown using automation. An altitude constraint was missed and aircraft descended early.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 777213 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200803 |
| Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | airport : slc.airport |
| State Reference | UT |
| Altitude | msl single value : 11000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : s56.tracon |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | B737 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Navigation In Use | other |
| Flight Phase | descent : approach |
| Route In Use | arrival star : leehy |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi pilot : commercial pilot : multi engine |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 7000 flight time type : 1000 |
| ASRS Report | 777213 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | aircraft equipment problem : less severe altitude deviation : crossing restriction not met non adherence : clearance non adherence : published procedure |
| Independent Detector | other flight crewa other flight crewb |
| Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | Flight Crew Human Performance ATC Human Performance Aircraft Airspace Structure |
| Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
Narrative:
While on the arrival; leehy two; the controller said to descend via the arrival. Later we were given the clearance to track the arrival for the runway 34R transition to besbe (FAF runway 34R) and land runway 35. The captain; PF; started to switch the runway to runway 35 in the FMS. While choosing runway 35; the FMS dropped some of the points on the STAR from the legs page. We were currently approaching blupe with a crossing of 12000 ft or above. The next fix is kaamp at 11000 ft. The captain then descended to 11000 ft prior to getting to blupe. There was no conflict. The use of RNAV arrivals in slc seems to be making things much more complicated than they used to be -- having flown in there consistently for the last 7 years. If there are any changes made to the FMS you risk losing legs that still need to be flown -- yet there is no way to fly these raw data. If RNAV SID's and STAR's are to be flown -- it seems that there needs to be little adjustment made to them via clearances/instructions.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A B737 PILOT COMMENTS THAT DURING A SLC FMS RNAV ARR RWY CHANGE WAYPOINTS WITH ALT CONSTRAINTS WERE DROPPED THAT MUST BE FLOWN USING AUTOMATION. AN ALT CONSTRAINT WAS MISSED AND ACFT DSNDED EARLY.
Narrative: WHILE ON THE ARRIVAL; LEEHY TWO; THE CONTROLLER SAID TO DESCEND VIA THE ARRIVAL. LATER WE WERE GIVEN THE CLEARANCE TO TRACK THE ARRIVAL FOR THE RWY 34R TRANSITION TO BESBE (FAF RWY 34R) AND LAND RWY 35. THE CAPTAIN; PF; STARTED TO SWITCH THE RWY TO RWY 35 IN THE FMS. WHILE CHOOSING RWY 35; THE FMS DROPPED SOME OF THE POINTS ON THE STAR FROM THE LEGS PAGE. WE WERE CURRENTLY APPROACHING BLUPE WITH A CROSSING OF 12000 FT OR ABOVE. THE NEXT FIX IS KAAMP AT 11000 FT. THE CAPTAIN THEN DESCENDED TO 11000 FT PRIOR TO GETTING TO BLUPE. THERE WAS NO CONFLICT. THE USE OF RNAV ARRIVALS IN SLC SEEMS TO BE MAKING THINGS MUCH MORE COMPLICATED THAN THEY USED TO BE -- HAVING FLOWN IN THERE CONSISTENTLY FOR THE LAST 7 YEARS. IF THERE ARE ANY CHANGES MADE TO THE FMS YOU RISK LOSING LEGS THAT STILL NEED TO BE FLOWN -- YET THERE IS NO WAY TO FLY THESE RAW DATA. IF RNAV SID'S AND STAR'S ARE TO BE FLOWN -- IT SEEMS THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE LITTLE ADJUSTMENT MADE TO THEM VIA CLEARANCES/INSTRUCTIONS.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of May 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.