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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 83801 |
Time | |
Date | 198803 |
Day | Tue |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : pmd |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 15000 msl bound upper : 15000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zla |
Operator | general aviation : corporate |
Make Model Name | Light Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | other vortac |
Flight Phase | climbout : initial climbout : intermediate altitude |
Route In Use | departure other departure sid : sid enroute airway : zla |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | Other |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : instrument |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 90 flight time total : 8400 flight time type : 75 |
ASRS Report | 83801 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | Other |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 25 flight time total : 7010 flight time type : 134 |
ASRS Report | 83914 |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : clearance other anomaly other other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other controllera |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance none taken : anomaly accepted other |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Navigational Facility |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Situations | |
Navigational Aid | Unspecified |
Narrative:
During climb out on the van nuys 5 departure, palmdale transition. Another aircraft we thought to be ahead of us, asked approach for 21000'. Approach says, 'I just did.' the other aircraft replies, 'oh, I'm sorry.' approach says in a punishing tone 'I'll give it to you again.' which he did, and then in the same voice says, 'give me a read back.' other aircraft complied. Approach then stated 'in the future, if you don't intend to go over the VOR (palmdale 114.5) advise approach.' other aircraft replies, 'we're doing the best we can because of the VOR signal.' he says, 'we have complained about this for over a week.' somewhere about here is when I stated that we also were not receiving a good signal below 13000'. We were out of 15000'. Our INS dropped off line during line-up on runway. Approach immediately jumped on our case and gave us a heading for vectors, then in the same tone asked us about what navigation system we were using. I stated that we were trying to couple the INS and use the VOR as well. There was some other brief conversation that trailed off and seemed insignificant. Approach then gave the other aircraft a collect phone number and told him to call when he got on the ground. We were given another frequency and thought no more of it until 10 or 15 min into the flight, la center gave us a phone number, something about pilot deviation.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: CORP LTT INVOLVED IN TRACK DEVIAITON DUE TO INS NAVIGATIONAL PROBLEM WITH PMD VORTAC WHILE ON VNY FIVE SID.
Narrative: DURING CLIMB OUT ON THE VAN NUYS 5 DEP, PALMDALE TRANSITION. ANOTHER ACFT WE THOUGHT TO BE AHEAD OF US, ASKED APCH FOR 21000'. APCH SAYS, 'I JUST DID.' THE OTHER ACFT REPLIES, 'OH, I'M SORRY.' APCH SAYS IN A PUNISHING TONE 'I'LL GIVE IT TO YOU AGAIN.' WHICH HE DID, AND THEN IN THE SAME VOICE SAYS, 'GIVE ME A READ BACK.' OTHER ACFT COMPLIED. APCH THEN STATED 'IN THE FUTURE, IF YOU DON'T INTEND TO GO OVER THE VOR (PALMDALE 114.5) ADVISE APCH.' OTHER ACFT REPLIES, 'WE'RE DOING THE BEST WE CAN BECAUSE OF THE VOR SIGNAL.' HE SAYS, 'WE HAVE COMPLAINED ABOUT THIS FOR OVER A WEEK.' SOMEWHERE ABOUT HERE IS WHEN I STATED THAT WE ALSO WERE NOT RECEIVING A GOOD SIGNAL BELOW 13000'. WE WERE OUT OF 15000'. OUR INS DROPPED OFF LINE DURING LINE-UP ON RWY. APCH IMMEDIATELY JUMPED ON OUR CASE AND GAVE US A HEADING FOR VECTORS, THEN IN THE SAME TONE ASKED US ABOUT WHAT NAV SYS WE WERE USING. I STATED THAT WE WERE TRYING TO COUPLE THE INS AND USE THE VOR AS WELL. THERE WAS SOME OTHER BRIEF CONVERSATION THAT TRAILED OFF AND SEEMED INSIGNIFICANT. APCH THEN GAVE THE OTHER ACFT A COLLECT PHONE NUMBER AND TOLD HIM TO CALL WHEN HE GOT ON THE GND. WE WERE GIVEN ANOTHER FREQ AND THOUGHT NO MORE OF IT UNTIL 10 OR 15 MIN INTO THE FLT, LA CENTER GAVE US A PHONE NUMBER, SOMETHING ABOUT PLT DEVIATION.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.