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Attributes | |
ACN | 103412 |
Time | |
Date | 198902 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : msn |
State Reference | WI |
Altitude | agl bound lower : 0 agl bound upper : 4000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zau artcc : zla |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Large Transport, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng |
Flight Phase | descent : approach descent other landing other |
Route In Use | approach : straight in |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : flight engineer pilot : commercial |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 4400 flight time type : 2100 |
ASRS Report | 103410 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted other |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Aircraft |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
We were flying from chicago to madison on IFR flight plan. Estimating landing at madison XXX local. Tower closes at XXX-3. About 30 mi out were cleared to 4000' and requested chicago center to request madison tower to remain open few extra minutes. ATC checked and said they would not. No ATIS, so got from green bay FSS the WX and altimeter setting. ATC cleared us to intercept final approach course for 36 localizer. Descended through base of overcast, intercepted runway 3L localizer and had airport and runway in sight. Had also had flight engineer broadcast at 14 mi and 11 mi out on unicom frequency our position and intentions. He also contacted our company on their ground at madison, advising position and intentions. Unable contact chicago ATC to get clearance for approach. Broadcast in blind on chicago (ATC frequency had been working) that we had runway in sight and were going to land. (Any other course of action would have put us back in IMC conditions. Talked with truck 'clearing runway 13(?)' about 5 mi out and confirmed it was clear of runway 36 (on unicom frequency). On short final, broadcast in blind also on tower frequency, and another airline responded ATC was trying to contact us. After landing and slowed down and unable to contact ATC, had other carrier's pilot relay to ATC we had landed and to close out flight plan. He confirmed the relay accomplished/flight plan closed. Though never really cleared for approach, believe we did right thing--safest course in landing due probability of either going back into IMC conditions west/O ATC sep, or losing sight of airport if we had tried to maintain VMC at low altitude, circling or whatever while trying to establish communication with ATC for an approach clearance.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: LOST COM, IFR, COMPLETED LNDG WITHOUT CLRNC.
Narrative: WE WERE FLYING FROM CHICAGO TO MADISON ON IFR FLT PLAN. ESTIMATING LNDG AT MADISON XXX LCL. TWR CLOSES AT XXX-3. ABOUT 30 MI OUT WERE CLRED TO 4000' AND REQUESTED CHICAGO CENTER TO REQUEST MADISON TWR TO REMAIN OPEN FEW EXTRA MINUTES. ATC CHKED AND SAID THEY WOULD NOT. NO ATIS, SO GOT FROM GREEN BAY FSS THE WX AND ALTIMETER SETTING. ATC CLRED US TO INTERCEPT FINAL APCH COURSE FOR 36 LOC. DSNDED THROUGH BASE OF OVCST, INTERCEPTED RWY 3L LOC AND HAD ARPT AND RWY IN SIGHT. HAD ALSO HAD FE BROADCAST AT 14 MI AND 11 MI OUT ON UNICOM FREQ OUR POS AND INTENTIONS. HE ALSO CONTACTED OUR COMPANY ON THEIR GND AT MADISON, ADVISING POS AND INTENTIONS. UNABLE CONTACT CHICAGO ATC TO GET CLRNC FOR APCH. BROADCAST IN BLIND ON CHICAGO (ATC FREQ HAD BEEN WORKING) THAT WE HAD RWY IN SIGHT AND WERE GOING TO LAND. (ANY OTHER COURSE OF ACTION WOULD HAVE PUT US BACK IN IMC CONDITIONS. TALKED WITH TRUCK 'CLRING RWY 13(?)' ABOUT 5 MI OUT AND CONFIRMED IT WAS CLR OF RWY 36 (ON UNICOM FREQ). ON SHORT FINAL, BROADCAST IN BLIND ALSO ON TWR FREQ, AND ANOTHER AIRLINE RESPONDED ATC WAS TRYING TO CONTACT US. AFTER LNDG AND SLOWED DOWN AND UNABLE TO CONTACT ATC, HAD OTHER CARRIER'S PLT RELAY TO ATC WE HAD LANDED AND TO CLOSE OUT FLT PLAN. HE CONFIRMED THE RELAY ACCOMPLISHED/FLT PLAN CLOSED. THOUGH NEVER REALLY CLRED FOR APCH, BELIEVE WE DID RIGHT THING--SAFEST COURSE IN LNDG DUE PROBABILITY OF EITHER GOING BACK INTO IMC CONDITIONS W/O ATC SEP, OR LOSING SIGHT OF ARPT IF WE HAD TRIED TO MAINTAIN VMC AT LOW ALT, CIRCLING OR WHATEVER WHILE TRYING TO ESTABLISH COM WITH ATC FOR AN APCH CLRNC.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.