Narrative:

I would like to comment on the new trups RNAV STAR for dca. I understand there are also several other new RNAV arrivals in the dc-area airports with similar issues. This debrief concerns this procedure as it relates to the MD80. I am not aware of how it affects other types of aircraft. Our former RNAV procedure into dca; the eldee 5 arrival; had 6 altitude crossing restrictions. That was not too difficult to comply with. The trups 1 arrival has 11 altitude crossing restrictions and adds 3 speed restrictions in the same distance as the previous eldee arrival. This results in an extremely intense operation on our aircraft. It takes the full; constant attention of both crew members to assure compliance and comes close to requiring the full envelope of the aircraft's limits. The MD80 is not known for being able to descend at a good rate while also reducing airspeed. In addition; there is absolutely no time available on this arrival to devote to approach briefings; dealing with cabin issues; calling our airport operations for special requests or any other item other than extremely close attention to the arrival restrictions by both pilots. The issue is not whether or not we can do it; we have. It is that it is way too easy to miss one of the numerous restrictions; potentially causing a certificate action or worse yet; loss of separation. On a recent arrival to dca while cleared via the trups 1 arrival; we were experiencing a 90+ knot tailwind component. It also appeared that we would have to have our engine and airfoil anti-ice turned on for the descent due to icing conditions. The MD80 cannot adequately run deicing at idle engine power. Doing so causes several [low pneumatic pressure] caution lights to illuminate telling us there is inadequate heated air to deice the aircraft. Due to these circumstances we felt that we would not be able to meet all the altitude and speed restrictions on the trups 1 arrival. We asked for the eldee 5 arrival but were told that arrival is not longer available; yet when we checked our chart manual's log of current pages we discovered that; sure enough; it is still is a valid arrival. When we asked about that we were told that it just isn't being used anymore. We were also told that if we could not accept the trups 1 arrival; we would be vectored over ric to dca. I didn't believe we had enough fuel for that circuitous routing that day so we decided to accept the trups arrival and if we could not comply; we would state so and do whatever was necessary at that time. While we descended the tailwind dropped off considerably and the icing conditions ended up being at a much lower altitude than originally thought so we were able to comply that day. On our arrival to dca yesterday on the trups 1 arrival; ATC apparently forgot to tell us to 'descend via' until we were approximately five miles before oourr (altitude crossing restriction of 13;000 ft) while we were at 16;000 ft. Due to my captain using close to extreme measures; we were able to comply by losing 3;000 ft in approximately 5 miles but in retrospect we should have stated that we were unable to comply with such a ridiculous request. Shortly after that; we--and every other arrival into dca--were taken off the trups and frdmm RNAV stars and given numerous vectors and speed clearances down to as low as 16;000 ft due to arrival aircraft overwhelming approach control. As a side note; we heard approach control telling an aircraft that he had missed at least one crossing altitude restriction. I'm sure it's not the first or the last. As winter approaches; I'm sure that there are going to be conditions that will not permit at least the MD80 to comply with the restrictions on these new RNAV approaches. They are way too complicated and should not have to be. It is only a matter of time before there will be certificate actions against pilots for non-compliance of these ridiculous crossing restrictions; and/or loss of separation between aircraft. These new RNAV arrivals need to be re-written and need to include common sense; practical; and easily-complied-with altitude and speed restrictions.

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: An MD80 pilot details his concerns about the complexity of the RNAV STARs into DCA with particular emphasis on the difficulties encountered with his fleet.

Narrative: I would like to comment on the new TRUPS RNAV STAR for DCA. I understand there are also several other new RNAV arrivals in the DC-area airports with similar issues. This debrief concerns this procedure as it relates to the MD80. I am not aware of how it affects other types of aircraft. Our former RNAV procedure into DCA; the ELDEE 5 Arrival; had 6 altitude crossing restrictions. That was not too difficult to comply with. The TRUPS 1 Arrival has 11 altitude crossing restrictions and adds 3 speed restrictions in the same distance as the previous ELDEE Arrival. This results in an extremely intense operation on our aircraft. It takes the FULL; CONSTANT attention of both crew members to assure compliance and comes close to requiring the full envelope of the aircraft's limits. The MD80 is not known for being able to descend at a good rate while also reducing airspeed. In addition; there is absolutely no time available on this arrival to devote to approach briefings; dealing with cabin issues; calling our Airport Operations for special requests or any other item other than extremely close attention to the arrival restrictions by both pilots. The issue is not whether or not we can do it; we have. It is that it is way too easy to miss one of the numerous restrictions; potentially causing a certificate action or worse yet; loss of separation. On a recent arrival to DCA while cleared via the TRUPS 1 Arrival; we were experiencing a 90+ knot tailwind component. It also appeared that we would have to have our engine and airfoil anti-ice turned on for the descent due to icing conditions. The MD80 cannot adequately run deicing at idle engine power. Doing so causes several [low pneumatic pressure] caution lights to illuminate telling us there is inadequate heated air to deice the aircraft. Due to these circumstances we felt that we would not be able to meet all the altitude and speed restrictions on the TRUPS 1 Arrival. We asked for the ELDEE 5 Arrival but were told that arrival is not longer available; yet when we checked our Chart Manual's Log of Current pages we discovered that; sure enough; it is still is a valid arrival. When we asked about that we were told that it just isn't being used anymore. We were also told that if we could not accept the TRUPS 1 Arrival; we would be vectored over RIC to DCA. I didn't believe we had enough fuel for that circuitous routing that day so we decided to accept the TRUPS Arrival and if we could not comply; we would state so and do whatever was necessary at that time. While we descended the tailwind dropped off considerably and the icing conditions ended up being at a much lower altitude than originally thought so we were able to comply that day. On our arrival to DCA yesterday on the TRUPS 1 Arrival; ATC apparently forgot to tell us to 'Descend Via' until we were approximately five miles before OOURR (altitude crossing restriction of 13;000 FT) while we were at 16;000 FT. Due to my Captain using close to extreme measures; we were able to comply by losing 3;000 FT in approximately 5 miles but in retrospect we should have stated that we were unable to comply with such a ridiculous request. Shortly after that; we--and every other arrival into DCA--were taken off the TRUPS and FRDMM RNAV STARs and given numerous vectors and speed clearances down to as low as 16;000 FT due to arrival aircraft overwhelming approach control. As a side note; we heard Approach Control telling an aircraft that he had missed at least one crossing altitude restriction. I'm sure it's not the first or the last. As winter approaches; I'm sure that there are going to be conditions that will not permit at least the MD80 to comply with the restrictions on these new RNAV approaches. They are way too complicated and should not have to be. It is only a matter of time before there will be certificate actions against pilots for non-compliance of these ridiculous crossing restrictions; and/or loss of separation between aircraft. These new RNAV arrivals need to be re-written and need to include common sense; practical; and easily-complied-with altitude and speed restrictions.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2013 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.