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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 118041 |
Time | |
Date | 198907 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : teb |
State Reference | NJ |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 1500 msl bound upper : 1800 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | IMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : teb tower : teb |
Operator | common carrier : air taxi |
Make Model Name | Small Transport, Low Wing, 2 Recip Eng |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | Other |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 216 flight time total : 7884 flight time type : 160 |
ASRS Report | 118041 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air taxi |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : instrument |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : crossing restriction not met altitude deviation : undershoot non adherence : clearance |
Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance none taken : anomaly accepted other |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Crossing vings intersection at 2000', we were cleared ny approach to 'cross dandy at 1500, cleared for the ILS runway 6 approach, contact teb tower.' the clearance was read back and accepted west/O correction. The captain continued at 2000'. I called attention to the 1500' and he remarked about the plate calling for 2000' at dandy. I showed him the notice about '*1500 when directed by ATC,' and he then commented that he was going to let down when he flew into the G/south, which seemed reasonable to me. As we were crossing dandy at 1800', tower called and said, 'descend immediately to 1500.' I said, 'roger, crossing dandy at 1800,' as we descended to 1500, and ultimately, G/south interception. In retrospect, I would probably have been more insistent on descending to 1500' initially, but I had it in my mind that 1500' was a minimum altitude. In fact, the normal 2000' is depicted as a minimum altitude, and the 1500' note gives no indication of a mandatory nature. (I do realize that when 'cleared to cross at...' the operative word is 'at.') I nonetheless believe that if this altitude is in fact mandatory on this procedure, it would be wise to depict it on the chart at 1500', and thereby eliminate any ambiguity.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLT CREW OF MEDIUM TWIN ENGINE AIRPLANE FAILS TO MEET CROSSING RESTRICTION ON APCH.
Narrative: XING VINGS INTXN AT 2000', WE WERE CLRED NY APCH TO 'CROSS DANDY AT 1500, CLRED FOR THE ILS RWY 6 APCH, CONTACT TEB TWR.' THE CLRNC WAS READ BACK AND ACCEPTED W/O CORRECTION. THE CAPT CONTINUED AT 2000'. I CALLED ATTN TO THE 1500' AND HE REMARKED ABOUT THE PLATE CALLING FOR 2000' AT DANDY. I SHOWED HIM THE NOTICE ABOUT '*1500 WHEN DIRECTED BY ATC,' AND HE THEN COMMENTED THAT HE WAS GOING TO LET DOWN WHEN HE FLEW INTO THE G/S, WHICH SEEMED REASONABLE TO ME. AS WE WERE XING DANDY AT 1800', TWR CALLED AND SAID, 'DSND IMMEDIATELY TO 1500.' I SAID, 'ROGER, XING DANDY AT 1800,' AS WE DSNDED TO 1500, AND ULTIMATELY, G/S INTERCEPTION. IN RETROSPECT, I WOULD PROBABLY HAVE BEEN MORE INSISTENT ON DSNDING TO 1500' INITIALLY, BUT I HAD IT IN MY MIND THAT 1500' WAS A MINIMUM ALT. IN FACT, THE NORMAL 2000' IS DEPICTED AS A MINIMUM ALT, AND THE 1500' NOTE GIVES NO INDICATION OF A MANDATORY NATURE. (I DO REALIZE THAT WHEN 'CLRED TO CROSS AT...' THE OPERATIVE WORD IS 'AT.') I NONETHELESS BELIEVE THAT IF THIS ALT IS IN FACT MANDATORY ON THIS PROC, IT WOULD BE WISE TO DEPICT IT ON THE CHART AT 1500', AND THEREBY ELIMINATE ANY AMBIGUITY.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.