When both runway 4 ILS's at ewr were out of service the flight crew of a B767 debated with dispatch ...

Attributes
ACN	1221077
Time
Date	201411
Place
Locale Reference	EWR.Airport
State Reference	NJ
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Make Model Name	B767 Undifferentiated or Other Model
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 121
Flight Phase	Cruise
Flight Plan	IFR
Component
Aircraft Component	INS / IRS / IRU
Person 1
Function	First Officer Pilot Not Flying
Qualification	Flight Crew Instrument Flight Crew Multiengine Flight Crew Air Transport Pilot (ATP)
Events
Anomaly	Aircraft Equipment Problem Less Severe Deviation - Procedural Published Material / Policy Inflight Event / Encounter Weather / Turbulence

Narrative:

Holding over slt on the arrival into ewr because ILS to both 4R and 4L have become out of service. Only approach is RNAV. We are unable to do these approaches due to being unqualified. After many attempts to contact dispatch we receive a reply asking why we are not shooting the RNAV approach. We send an unable reply. We then; shortly thereafter; receive another reply from dispatch stating--and I am quoting because I printed and saved the message--'per fom you can do RNAV GPS approaches just not RNAV rnp. So you should be good to continue.' [signed]. At best this is massive incompetence from both the dispatcher and flight operations duty manager and at worst purposeful deception to try to get us to complete the flight. The ILS eventually came back online and we proceeded uneventfully.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: When both runway 4 ILS's at EWR were out of service the flight crew of a B767 debated with Dispatch about their legality to fly the published RNAV procedures.

Narrative: Holding over SLT on the arrival into EWR because ILS to both 4R and 4L have become out of service. Only approach is RNAV. We are unable to do these approaches due to being unqualified. After many attempts to contact dispatch we receive a reply asking why we are not shooting the RNAV approach. We send an unable reply. We then; shortly thereafter; receive another reply from dispatch stating--and I am quoting because I printed and saved the message--'per FOM you can do RNAV GPS approaches just not RNAV RNP. So you should be good to continue.' [Signed]. At best this is massive incompetence from both the dispatcher and flight operations duty manager and at worst purposeful deception to try to get us to complete the flight. The ILS eventually came back online and we proceeded uneventfully.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.

When both runway 4 ILS's at ewr were out of service the flight crew of a B767 debated with dispatch about their legality to fly the published RNAV procedures.