37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 140535 |
Time | |
Date | 199003 |
Day | Mon |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : yyz |
State Reference | ON |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 6300 msl bound upper : 7700 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : yyz tower : atl |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Large Transport, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng |
Flight Phase | other |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : second officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : flight engineer pilot : commercial pilot : atp pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 150 flight time total : 5100 flight time type : 150 |
ASRS Report | 140539 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : excursion from assigned altitude non adherence : clearance |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : returned to intended course or assigned course other |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Holding was assigned due to toronto WX going down due to fog. As captain entered holding pattern at 7000' MSL, the first officer spoke up and said you are turning in the wrong direction. I was on the #3 radio at this time, talking with dispatch about the WX in toronto. The autoplt was off. The captain and first officer were so involved discussing the holding pattern that the aircraft started descending. I advised the captain at 6900' of altitude. He made no correction and continued to discuss the holding pattern. I again advised altitude at 6800' MSL. No correction was made. The first officer made an attempt at this time to assume command. I again said altitude, 'you are descending.' this continued to 6300' MSL. I again said loudly, 'you have to get your altitude back.' he then abruptly started a climb at 2000 FPM. During the climb he began discussing the holding pattern once again with the first officer. As the captain approached 7000' MSL, I said, 'altitude.' now we were through 7300' MSL. I continued in a very persistent voice to remind him of our altitude. It continued to 7700' MSL. He leveled out there and stayed level for approximately 1 min, then started a slow descent to 7000'. I continued to remind him that he needs to get back to 7000'. ATC did not once ask us about our altitude. I believe the first officer should have assumed control of the aircraft when the captain was obviously making no attempt to hold altitude. The quality of performance was affected by their complete involvement into the holding pattern, which was given with a short notice. The autoplt should have been put on. I made this suggestion.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: NONADHERENCE TO DUTY PRIORITIES IN COCKPIT LED TO ALT EXCURSION FOR ACR LGT.
Narrative: HOLDING WAS ASSIGNED DUE TO TORONTO WX GOING DOWN DUE TO FOG. AS CAPT ENTERED HOLDING PATTERN AT 7000' MSL, THE F/O SPOKE UP AND SAID YOU ARE TURNING IN THE WRONG DIRECTION. I WAS ON THE #3 RADIO AT THIS TIME, TALKING WITH DISPATCH ABOUT THE WX IN TORONTO. THE AUTOPLT WAS OFF. THE CAPT AND F/O WERE SO INVOLVED DISCUSSING THE HOLDING PATTERN THAT THE ACFT STARTED DSNDING. I ADVISED THE CAPT AT 6900' OF ALT. HE MADE NO CORRECTION AND CONTINUED TO DISCUSS THE HOLDING PATTERN. I AGAIN ADVISED ALT AT 6800' MSL. NO CORRECTION WAS MADE. THE F/O MADE AN ATTEMPT AT THIS TIME TO ASSUME COMMAND. I AGAIN SAID ALT, 'YOU ARE DSNDING.' THIS CONTINUED TO 6300' MSL. I AGAIN SAID LOUDLY, 'YOU HAVE TO GET YOUR ALT BACK.' HE THEN ABRUPTLY STARTED A CLB AT 2000 FPM. DURING THE CLB HE BEGAN DISCUSSING THE HOLDING PATTERN ONCE AGAIN WITH THE F/O. AS THE CAPT APCHED 7000' MSL, I SAID, 'ALT.' NOW WE WERE THROUGH 7300' MSL. I CONTINUED IN A VERY PERSISTENT VOICE TO REMIND HIM OF OUR ALT. IT CONTINUED TO 7700' MSL. HE LEVELED OUT THERE AND STAYED LEVEL FOR APPROX 1 MIN, THEN STARTED A SLOW DSCNT TO 7000'. I CONTINUED TO REMIND HIM THAT HE NEEDS TO GET BACK TO 7000'. ATC DID NOT ONCE ASK US ABOUT OUR ALT. I BELIEVE THE F/O SHOULD HAVE ASSUMED CONTROL OF THE ACFT WHEN THE CAPT WAS OBVIOUSLY MAKING NO ATTEMPT TO HOLD ALT. THE QUALITY OF PERFORMANCE WAS AFFECTED BY THEIR COMPLETE INVOLVEMENT INTO THE HOLDING PATTERN, WHICH WAS GIVEN WITH A SHORT NOTICE. THE AUTOPLT SHOULD HAVE BEEN PUT ON. I MADE THIS SUGGESTION.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.