37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 1427501 |
Time | |
Date | 201702 |
Local Time Of Day | 0601-1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | DCA.Tower |
State Reference | DC |
Environment | |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | Final Approach |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Function | Instructor Local |
Qualification | Air Traffic Control Fully Certified |
Experience | Air Traffic Control Time Certified In Pos 1 (yrs) 1.5 |
Person 2 | |
Function | Ground |
Qualification | Air Traffic Control Fully Certified |
Experience | Air Traffic Control Time Certified In Pos 1 (yrs) 3.5 |
Events | |
Anomaly | ATC Issue All Types Deviation - Procedural Published Material / Policy |
Narrative:
I was training a developmental in local control. Our traffic manager tried coordinating with pct traffic management unit for us to receive at least a 4-mile final during the time of our heavy departure push; to accommodate at least a one-for-one operation and result in the most safe; efficient; and expeditious operation here at dca. A restriction for this was even logged and accepted in the tmu system. Our flm also tried coordinating with pct flm for us to receive at least a 4-mile final during the time of our heavy departure push as well. All of the coordination for the request for a 4-mile final was accomplished; reasonably justified; and completed per the pct/dca LOA. Yet; our request for a 4-mile final was disregarded (as they usually are) and we end up getting an average of about a 2 - 3 mile final.due to the winds; the few aircraft that are usually able to land runway 15 were not able to do so today; so for the most part we were left with a one runway operation and getting only a 2 - 3 mile final for our entire departure push. As you can see; this puts us in a bind which leaves us in a lose-lose situation. We have 2 options; either try your best to make some of these impossible 'squeeze-plays' work; or simply choose not to risk it and hold all of the departure's until the final controller at pct decides to allow us to departure again. If we decide to push-it and try to depart in a 3 mile gap we run the risk of not meeting the standard runway separation minima (which for the most part is 6;000 ft and airborne for us) and catching a deal or us having to send the arrival aircraft around on a very short notice while the aircraft is on short final; putting a lot of stress and pressure on the pilot. Here at dca we have our fair share of 'go-arounds' mainly because of this same issue; and our tower team gets scrutinized endlessly for it. Our tower team also gets scrutinized for the extensive departure delays; and not meeting traffic management release times; which many times it's because of us not being able to departure for a long period of time while we are getting jammed on final. Many of the delays are not even tracked accurately due to the fact that when the departures get backed up like this; they will begin to block the taxiways; and the ground controller will be unable to even push departure aircraft off of their gates. This means that numerous departure aircraft will be holding at their gates getting delayed for an extensive amount of time; waiting for the taxiways to clear up so that they can finally push and get going; all while their delay is not being tracked because the ground controller does not scan them until they start taxiing. As you can imagine; this also puts a lot of stress and pressure on the ground controller as well when the departure's get so backed up like this because they have to make sure that they do not block any of the runway exit points so that the arrivals may exit the runway in time and not conflict with the next arrival who's just 2 - 3 miles out. Today I instructed my developmental to play it safe and not take any chances on causing a loss of separation or go-around; and it ended up causing some extensive delays. We (dca controllers) have expressed and continue to express our concern for safety on this matter to all parties involved (dca management; pct management; pct tmu; etc) numerous times; but it feels like we just continue to get disregarded by everybody. We've gotten into so many back and forth arguments with the pct final controllers; that their management have restricted us on contacting them over the landlines to coordinate appropriate spacing on final. The pct final controllers will usually claim to being overloaded with so many arrivals that they are unable to provide us with a 4-mile final; and will blame their tmu for causing an overload in arrivals. Tmu will then probably blame somebody else; and in the end it feels like we are the ones here at dca getting screwed; being forced to run an unsafe operation; getting blamed for close calls; go-arounds; losses of separation; missed release times; and even delays. My concern is safety; expeditiousness; and efficiency. How safe; expeditious; and efficient are we being here at dca when we are either forced to hold and delay all of our departures while final brings in all of their arrivals at the bare minimum spacing; or forced to uncomfortably try to squeeze out a departure in a 3-mile gap. I would recommend a couple things: 1. When we request a restriction for spacing on final; for it to be honored. We are requesting it for a reason; we know our limitations and capabilities. Whether it falls on pct management to enforce it onto their final controller to adhere to this restriction; or whether it falls on pct tmu to make appropriate adjustments on the flow so that the pct final controller is not left without the ability to accommodate our restriction; or maybe both need to be done; but something needs to happen. We should not be disregarded on this crucial safety concern.2. Instead of us putting in a request to depart; it should be the standard; pct should be the ones to put in a request to jam us on final. 3. Put a system in place here at dca where if it is absolutely necessary to jam us on final; then officially stop us on departures and bring them in as tight as you can. By jamming us on final you are essentially stopping us on departures anyway. Let us know when you are able to provide adequate spacing on final for us to begin departing again. This will alleviate putting the constant stress and pressure on the dca controller to think that they have to find a way to get a departure out; which will essentially cause close-calls; loss of separation; go-arounds; and overall unsafe situations. This will also put the blame for all the delays on the true person responsible. 4. Arrival traffic flow into dca should be managed and executed better in the first place so it does not get to the point of putting safety and efficiency at risk.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: DCA Tower controllers reported that they requested 4 miles in trail from Potomac TRACON for aircraft landing DCA. It was agreed by both facility Traffic Managers; but PCT gave DCA 2-3 miles.
Narrative: I was training a developmental in LC. Our Traffic Manager tried coordinating with PCT Traffic Management Unit for us to receive at least a 4-mile final during the time of our heavy departure push; to accommodate at least a one-for-one operation and result in the most safe; efficient; and expeditious operation here at DCA. A restriction for this was even logged and accepted in the TMU system. Our FLM also tried coordinating with PCT FLM for us to receive at least a 4-mile final during the time of our heavy departure push as well. All of the coordination for the request for a 4-mile final was accomplished; reasonably justified; and completed per the PCT/DCA LOA. Yet; our request for a 4-mile final was disregarded (as they usually are) and we end up getting an average of about a 2 - 3 mile final.Due to the winds; the few aircraft that are usually able to land RWY 15 were not able to do so today; so for the most part we were left with a one runway operation and getting only a 2 - 3 mile final for our entire Departure push. As you can see; this puts us in a bind which leaves us in a lose-lose situation. We have 2 options; either try your best to make some of these impossible 'squeeze-plays' work; or simply choose not to risk it and hold all of the Departure's until the Final Controller at PCT decides to allow us to Departure again. If we decide to push-it and try to depart in a 3 mile gap we run the risk of not meeting the standard runway separation minima (which for the most part is 6;000 ft and airborne for us) and catching a deal or us having to send the Arrival aircraft around on a very short notice while the aircraft is on short final; putting a lot of stress and pressure on the pilot. Here at DCA we have our fair share of 'Go-Arounds' mainly because of this same issue; and our tower team gets scrutinized endlessly for it. Our tower team also gets scrutinized for the extensive departure delays; and not meeting Traffic Management release times; which many times it's because of us not being able to Departure for a long period of time while we are getting jammed on final. Many of the delays are not even tracked accurately due to the fact that when the Departures get backed up like this; they will begin to block the taxiways; and the Ground Controller will be unable to even Push Departure aircraft off of their gates. This means that numerous Departure aircraft will be holding at their gates getting delayed for an extensive amount of time; waiting for the taxiways to clear up so that they can finally push and get going; all while their delay is not being tracked because the Ground Controller does not scan them until they start taxiing. As you can imagine; this also puts a lot of stress and pressure on the Ground Controller as well when the Departure's get so backed up like this because they have to make sure that they do not block any of the runway exit points so that the Arrivals may exit the runway in time and not conflict with the next Arrival who's just 2 - 3 miles out. Today I instructed my developmental to play it safe and not take any chances on causing a loss of separation or go-around; and it ended up causing some extensive delays. We (DCA controllers) have expressed and continue to express our concern for safety on this matter to all parties involved (DCA management; PCT Management; PCT TMU; etc) numerous times; but it feels like we just continue to get disregarded by everybody. We've gotten into so many back and forth arguments with the PCT Final Controllers; that their management have restricted us on contacting them over the landlines to coordinate appropriate spacing on final. The PCT Final Controllers will usually claim to being overloaded with so many arrivals that they are unable to provide us with a 4-mile final; and will blame their TMU for causing an overload in arrivals. TMU will then probably blame somebody else; and in the end it feels like we are the ones here at DCA getting screwed; being forced to run an unsafe operation; getting blamed for close calls; go-arounds; losses of separation; missed release times; and even delays. My concern is safety; expeditiousness; and efficiency. How safe; expeditious; and efficient are we being here at DCA when we are either forced to hold and delay all of our Departures while final brings in all of their Arrivals at the bare minimum spacing; or forced to uncomfortably try to squeeze out a Departure in a 3-mile gap. I would recommend a couple things: 1. When we request a restriction for spacing on final; for it to be honored. We are requesting it for a reason; we know our limitations and capabilities. Whether it falls on PCT management to enforce it onto their Final Controller to adhere to this restriction; OR whether it falls on PCT TMU to make appropriate adjustments on the flow so that the PCT Final Controller is not left without the ability to accommodate our restriction; OR maybe both need to be done; but something needs to happen. We should not be disregarded on this crucial safety concern.2. Instead of us putting in a request to depart; it should be the standard; PCT should be the ones to put in a request to jam us on final. 3. Put a system in place here at DCA where if it is absolutely necessary to jam us on final; then OFFICIALLY stop us on Departures and bring them in as tight as you can. By jamming us on Final you are essentially stopping us on Departures anyway. Let us know when you are able to provide adequate spacing on final for us to begin Departing again. This will alleviate putting the constant stress and pressure on the DCA controller to think that they have to find a way to get a Departure out; which will essentially cause close-calls; loss of separation; go-arounds; and overall unsafe situations. This will also put the blame for all the delays on the true person responsible. 4. Arrival Traffic Flow into DCA should be managed and executed better in the first place so it does not get to the point of putting safety and efficiency at risk.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.