Air carrier medium large transport altitude deviation overshot during descent. Clearance altitude wa...

Attributes
ACN	143185
Time
Date	199004
Day	Mon
Local Time Of Day	0601 To 1200
Place
Locale Reference	atc facility : clt
State Reference	NC
Altitude	msl bound lower : 10000 msl bound upper : 12000
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng
Flight Phase	cruise other descent other
Route In Use	arrival star : star enroute airway : ztl
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : first officer
Qualification	pilot : atp
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 150 flight time total : 4000 flight time type : 300
ASRS Report	143185
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 150 flight time total : 7000 flight time type : 400
ASRS Report	143183
Events
Anomaly	altitude deviation : overshoot non adherence : clearance
Independent Detector	other controllera
Resolutory Action	controller : issued new clearance
Consequence	Other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	ATC Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	Pilot Deviation Operational Deviation other

Narrative:

Flight from lex to clt executing shine 1 arrival. We were given a clearance to cross 40 northwest of clt at 10000', which was read back to controller. We questioned the altitude between ourselves because the arrival calls to cross at 12000'. Center called us back with a heading to fly and we read back the new clearance, again stating that we were descending to 10000'. No reply from center; he went on talking to other traffic. Upon reaching 10000' center called us and asked our altitude. We said, '10000.' he said we were cleared to 12000'. We asked if we should climb back up. He said, 'no, do nothing.' we said we had been cleared to 10000' and that we read it back to him twice. He said it was ok, he'd work it out with approach and not to worry about it. At this point he sounded apologetic. He was very busy during the whole time we were in contact. A few times he had stated for everyone to listen up, he only had time to say things once. Problem arose due to busy controller, lots of traffic and not listening to readback. Discovered by controller asking us our altitude when at 10000'. The controller was busy, stressed sounding. We tried to confirm our altitude in our 2 readbacks but got no response. When we told controller we were at 10000' he was at first angry. When we explained we had read back 10000' twice in our clrncs, he was then apologetic and required us to take no action, not to worry about it. Supplemental information from acn 143183: it should be noted that it was very crowded and more than once the controller told everyone on the frequency to 'listen up,' and 'everyone please be quiet.'

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: ACR MLG ALT DEVIATION OVERSHOT DURING DESCENT. CLRNC ALT WAS READ BACK TWICE IN AN EFFORT TO GET CONFIRMATION OF WHAT THE FLT CREW THOUGHT MIGHT BE AN INCORRECT ALT, BUT NEITHER READBACK WAS CHALLENGED.

Narrative: FLT FROM LEX TO CLT EXECUTING SHINE 1 ARR. WE WERE GIVEN A CLRNC TO CROSS 40 NW OF CLT AT 10000', WHICH WAS READ BACK TO CTLR. WE QUESTIONED THE ALT BTWN OURSELVES BECAUSE THE ARR CALLS TO CROSS AT 12000'. CENTER CALLED US BACK WITH A HDG TO FLY AND WE READ BACK THE NEW CLRNC, AGAIN STATING THAT WE WERE DSNDING TO 10000'. NO REPLY FROM CENTER; HE WENT ON TALKING TO OTHER TFC. UPON REACHING 10000' CENTER CALLED US AND ASKED OUR ALT. WE SAID, '10000.' HE SAID WE WERE CLRED TO 12000'. WE ASKED IF WE SHOULD CLB BACK UP. HE SAID, 'NO, DO NOTHING.' WE SAID WE HAD BEEN CLRED TO 10000' AND THAT WE READ IT BACK TO HIM TWICE. HE SAID IT WAS OK, HE'D WORK IT OUT WITH APCH AND NOT TO WORRY ABOUT IT. AT THIS POINT HE SOUNDED APOLOGETIC. HE WAS VERY BUSY DURING THE WHOLE TIME WE WERE IN CONTACT. A FEW TIMES HE HAD STATED FOR EVERYONE TO LISTEN UP, HE ONLY HAD TIME TO SAY THINGS ONCE. PROB AROSE DUE TO BUSY CTLR, LOTS OF TFC AND NOT LISTENING TO READBACK. DISCOVERED BY CTLR ASKING US OUR ALT WHEN AT 10000'. THE CTLR WAS BUSY, STRESSED SOUNDING. WE TRIED TO CONFIRM OUR ALT IN OUR 2 READBACKS BUT GOT NO RESPONSE. WHEN WE TOLD CTLR WE WERE AT 10000' HE WAS AT FIRST ANGRY. WHEN WE EXPLAINED WE HAD READ BACK 10000' TWICE IN OUR CLRNCS, HE WAS THEN APOLOGETIC AND REQUIRED US TO TAKE NO ACTION, NOT TO WORRY ABOUT IT. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 143183: IT SHOULD BE NOTED THAT IT WAS VERY CROWDED AND MORE THAN ONCE THE CTLR TOLD EVERYONE ON THE FREQ TO 'LISTEN UP,' AND 'EVERYONE PLEASE BE QUIET.'

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.

Air carrier medium large transport altitude deviation overshot during descent. Clearance altitude was read back twice in an effort to get confirmation of what the flight crew thought might be an incorrect altitude, but neither readback was challenged.