 |
37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Flight crew of large transport in position and hold given winds different than previously stated, a tailwind. Takeoff overweight for flap setting used.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 146505 |
| Time | |
| Date | 199005 |
| Day | Sun |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | atc facility : msy |
| State Reference | LA |
| Altitude | agl bound lower : 0 agl bound upper : 0 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | Large Transport, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng |
| Flight Phase | climbout : takeoff |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : flight engineer |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 230 flight time total : 12000 flight time type : 700 |
| ASRS Report | 146505 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : flight engineer pilot : atp |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 230 flight time total : 7000 flight time type : 700 |
| ASRS Report | 146841 |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted |
| Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
| Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Assigned runway 19 msy, 7000', temperature 88 degree. Second officer selected correct numbers and weight for runway. Numbers were correctly set by captain and first officer and verified by second officer. Cleared onto runway to hold. When cleared for takeoff tower gave wind as 030/05, a 5 KT tailwind. A miscalculation and miscom resulted in a takeoff approximately 4000 pounds overweight for the flap setting selected. Takeoff successful. This potentially serious takeoff situation could have been prevented by more correct communication between crew members. Also, noise abatement preference runways present serious risks when use is continued with tailwinds. After takeoff tower controller asked if we thought tailwind affected takeoff performance. We agreed that it did. He then stated that they were considering changing runways. Supplemental information from acn 146841. Cleared for takeoff and wind called at 040/4 KTS wind discussed before takeoff but no indepth look to see how it really affected us. I gave captain bad gouge be saying off handedly 'it'll make it'. Question: why none of us automatically considered 25 degree flap takeoff?
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLT CREW OF LGT IN POSITION AND HOLD GIVEN WINDS DIFFERENT THAN PREVIOUSLY STATED, A TAILWIND. TKOF OVERWEIGHT FOR FLAP SETTING USED.
Narrative: ASSIGNED RWY 19 MSY, 7000', TEMP 88 DEG. S/O SELECTED CORRECT NUMBERS AND WT FOR RWY. NUMBERS WERE CORRECTLY SET BY CAPT AND F/O AND VERIFIED BY S/O. CLRED ONTO RWY TO HOLD. WHEN CLRED FOR TKOF TWR GAVE WIND AS 030/05, A 5 KT TAILWIND. A MISCALCULATION AND MISCOM RESULTED IN A TKOF APPROX 4000 LBS OVERWT FOR THE FLAP SETTING SELECTED. TKOF SUCCESSFUL. THIS POTENTIALLY SERIOUS TKOF SITUATION COULD HAVE BEEN PREVENTED BY MORE CORRECT COM BTWN CREW MEMBERS. ALSO, NOISE ABATEMENT PREFERENCE RWYS PRESENT SERIOUS RISKS WHEN USE IS CONTINUED WITH TAILWINDS. AFTER TKOF TWR CTLR ASKED IF WE THOUGHT TAILWIND AFFECTED TKOF PERFORMANCE. WE AGREED THAT IT DID. HE THEN STATED THAT THEY WERE CONSIDERING CHANGING RWYS. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 146841. CLRED FOR TKOF AND WIND CALLED AT 040/4 KTS WIND DISCUSSED BEFORE TKOF BUT NO INDEPTH LOOK TO SEE HOW IT REALLY AFFECTED US. I GAVE CAPT BAD GOUGE BE SAYING OFF HANDEDLY 'IT'LL MAKE IT'. QUESTION: WHY NONE OF US AUTOMATICALLY CONSIDERED 25 DEG FLAP TKOF?
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.