37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 1516955 |
Time | |
Date | 201802 |
Local Time Of Day | 1801-2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | DCA.Airport |
State Reference | DC |
Environment | |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Make Model Name | B737 Next Generation Undifferentiated |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | Descent |
Route In Use | STAR TRUPS3 |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Function | Pilot Not Flying First Officer |
Qualification | Flight Crew Air Transport Pilot (ATP) |
Experience | Flight Crew Last 90 Days 316 |
Person 2 | |
Function | Pilot Flying Captain |
Qualification | Flight Crew Air Transport Pilot (ATP) |
Experience | Flight Crew Last 90 Days 328 |
Events | |
Anomaly | ATC Issue All Types Deviation - Altitude Overshoot Deviation - Procedural Clearance |
Narrative:
While on the descend via portion of the TRUPS3 landing north runway 1 transition into dca with a clearance limit to 6000 ft. ATC cleared us to katrn. While initially not understanding the waypoint due to communication congestion and not recognizing the fix on the legs portion of the arrival I promptly queried the washington center controller. Direct to what fix I asked and the controller replied katrn and gave the identifier for the waypoint. Promptly consulting the captain I asked if he understood the waypoint due to radio congestion and issues hearing the controller clearly. Still not confident with the waypoint I ask ATC a third time please verify the waypoint you would like us to proceed direct to. Washington sternly replies back with a DME mileage and repeats katrn and informs us the fix is on the approach portion of the ILS to runway 1. Promptly finding the fix we proceed direct to katrn as directed by ATC. At this portion of the flight we are continuing to descend through 9500 ft when we hear aircraft Y query ATC about a fix and an altitude of 11000ft. ATC responds saying no the 11000ft clearance was for [us]. This being the first time to my knowledge we were ever given an altitude limit of 11000 ft. I promptly ask ATC; you need aircraft X to maintain 11000ft? ATC replies yes aircraft X maintain 11000 ft. After hearing the altitude limit I immediately notice that we are defending through 9500 ft and I question the captain by asking him if he ever remembers a previous altitude clearance to maintain 11000 ft given. His reply is no; I never remember being given any other clearance given other than proceed direct to katrn. After being given the altitude limit we begin a climb from 9500 ft to the altitude 11000 ft. Now very close to the airport environment and also high the controller realizes that we need a turn to descend for landing. ATC then issues a vector by telling us to turn initially to a heading 150 then immediately corrects that to 170 degrees. Once in the turn to 170 degrees the controller promptly hands us off to dca approach. Once in contact we are cleared for the mount vernon visual for the runway 1.in this case clearer and precise communication between both us and the controller would have greatly helped in alleviating the workload and initial confusion finding the katrn waypoint. Clear communication also would have allowed and allotted the time wasted fixating on finding the waypoint. Also proper communication. We do not remember or were not aware of ever being given an altitude limit of 11;000. Either we missed the altitude limit or ATC never issued us the altitude limit but to the best of my knowledge I never remember being given an altitude limit once we were cleared to the katrn waypoint nor did ATC query us for an acknowledgement of the altitude clearance.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: B737 flight crew reported receiving a clearance that did not include a revised altitude assignment from the Center controller.
Narrative: While on the descend via portion of the TRUPS3 landing North RWY 1 transition into DCA with a clearance limit to 6000 ft. ATC cleared us to KATRN. While initially not understanding the waypoint due to communication congestion and not recognizing the fix on the Legs portion of the arrival I promptly queried the Washington center controller. Direct to what fix I asked and the controller replied KATRN and gave the identifier for the waypoint. Promptly consulting the captain I asked if he understood the waypoint due to radio congestion and issues hearing the controller clearly. Still not confident with the waypoint I ask ATC a third time please verify the waypoint you would like us to proceed direct to. Washington sternly replies back with a DME mileage and repeats KATRN and informs us the fix is on the approach portion of the ILS to RWY 1. Promptly finding the fix we proceed direct to KATRN as directed by ATC. At this portion of the flight we are continuing to descend through 9500 ft when we hear Aircraft Y query ATC about a fix and an altitude of 11000ft. ATC responds saying no the 11000ft clearance was for [us]. This being the first time to my knowledge we were ever given an altitude limit of 11000 ft. I promptly ask ATC; you need Aircraft X to maintain 11000ft? ATC replies yes Aircraft X Maintain 11000 ft. After hearing the altitude limit I immediately notice that we are defending through 9500 ft and I question the Captain by asking him if he ever remembers a previous altitude clearance to maintain 11000 ft given. His reply is no; I never remember being given any other clearance given other than proceed direct to KATRN. After being given the altitude limit we begin a climb from 9500 ft to the altitude 11000 ft. Now very close to the airport environment and also high the controller realizes that we need a turn to descend for landing. ATC then issues a vector by telling us to turn initially to a HDG 150 then immediately corrects that to 170 degrees. Once in the turn to 170 degrees the controller promptly hands us off to DCA approach. Once in contact we are cleared for the Mount Vernon visual for the RWY 1.In this case clearer and precise communication between both us and the Controller would have greatly helped in alleviating the workload and initial confusion finding the KATRN waypoint. Clear communication also would have allowed and allotted the time wasted fixating on finding the waypoint. Also proper communication. We do not remember or were not aware of ever being given an altitude limit of 11;000. Either we missed the altitude limit or ATC never issued us the altitude limit but to the best of my knowledge I never remember being given an altitude limit once we were cleared to the KATRN waypoint nor did ATC query us for an acknowledgement of the altitude clearance.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.