37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 1531848 |
Time | |
Date | 201804 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | ZZZZ.Airport |
State Reference | FO |
Aircraft 1 | |
Make Model Name | B767 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | Parked |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Component | |
Aircraft Component | INS / IRS / IRU |
Person 1 | |
Function | Captain |
Qualification | Flight Crew Air Transport Pilot (ATP) |
Experience | Flight Crew Total 10504 Flight Crew Type 7750 |
Events | |
Anomaly | Aircraft Equipment Problem Less Severe Deviation - Procedural MEL Deviation - Procedural Maintenance Deviation - Procedural Published Material / Policy |
Narrative:
Arrived at gate and learned ZZZZ mechanics were going to defer an item for Cat3 status message. We read MEL and it said test needed to be done to verify all autopilots would engage individually. I asked maintenance supervisor if he had done that and he seemed a bit surprised but said his colleague did or would or something like that. Guy shows up and can't get the autopilots to stay engaged and he's a bit confused. We watch this for 5 minutes or so and some creative ideas of what he is doing on the side panel to no avail and I convince them to call maintenance control. They do so; tell him the autopilots don't stay engaged; and he doesn't know what to do now.maintenance control then decides to change the MEL to inoperative the left adiru (air data inertial reference unit) and he is sending the maintenance card over the printer. I speak to him and he tells me that the write-up said 'no land 3 with a left adiru EICAS message.' I thought I had earlier been told it was a status message. Anyway; we go through the whole thing; I check on maintenance guys cockpit selections as they are a little loosey goosey with some of the semantics on the MEL and all is good. Left adiru to off; left it to center.I'm a bit curious how the wrong MEL was applied in the first place and wonder if I hadn't had them specifically check the autopilots what would have happened once airborne. It appears a divert would have been necessary. Maintenance seems to be getting a little sloppy lately. So now we are in cruise and driving along and after we coast out we notice we do not have satcom and that since we just left VHF coverage our cldlc isn't working.1. There was no mention of this on the MEL. Can you consider adding it to MEL since the satcom antennae works off the adiru and it appears to be the left one.2. The new flight manual bulletin [is] a little cryptic. The HF data mode was working if we had it in data mode but the new SOP has us take it out of data mode. The language in bulletin says you can use it for company ACARS communication if satcom is ions but ought to elaborate on need for operational control obligations. Our ACARS messages were delayed by over 30 minutes between dispatch and us so I'm not sure how accurate the bulletin guidance was or is.3. The first officers were of the impression that shanwick oceanic was sufficient for operational control purposes and I was 99% sure it was not. We debated if in fact it was necessary to patch to and ldoc (long distance operations control) (they had never heard that term and had no idea how to even do it. Not my first time hearing this in my fleet of late). Back and forth delayed messages with dispatch clearly established he couldn't reach us and he was attempting to selcal us with ny ldoc at about the same time I was calling ny ldoc. This required one HF for ATC gp and one for ldoc. We made contact and advised of our problem with comms due to left adiru deferral and continued with ldoc for operational control. Spoke to dispatch on ground and he mentioned it took him a long time to get a message to us from shanwick and even then we didn't get it until after establishing contact with ny ldoc.inbound to ZZZ I wrote up the satcom and ACARS being inoperative when out of VHF range due to the MEL deferral hoping the next crew wouldn't be surprised like we were. The MEL regarding this should expand on the limitations of not having satcom and mention the need to ensure operational control is maintained as it was clearly lost on this flight for some time.the fleet or standards needs to emphasize the need for operational control. I have noticed number of incumbent pilots who really don't understand who we are talking to and for what purposes nor the obligations for same.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: B767 Captain reported a CAT3 status message was incorrectly deferred then Maintenance changed the deferral to the left Air Data Intertial Reference Unit (ADIRU) which caused the SATCOM to be unusable.
Narrative: Arrived at gate and learned ZZZZ mechanics were going to defer an item for Cat3 status message. We read MEL and it said test needed to be done to verify all autopilots would engage individually. I asked maintenance supervisor if he had done that and he seemed a bit surprised but said his colleague did or would or something like that. Guy shows up and can't get the autopilots to stay engaged and he's a bit confused. We watch this for 5 minutes or so and some creative ideas of what he is doing on the side panel to no avail and I convince them to call Maintenance Control. They do so; tell him the autopilots don't stay engaged; and he doesn't know what to do now.Maintenance Control then decides to change the MEL to inoperative the left ADIRU (Air Data Inertial Reference Unit) and he is sending the maintenance card over the printer. I speak to him and he tells me that the write-up said 'no land 3 with a left ADIRU EICAS message.' I thought I had earlier been told it was a status message. Anyway; we go through the whole thing; I check on maintenance guys cockpit selections as they are a little loosey goosey with some of the semantics on the MEL and all is good. Left ADIRU to off; left it to center.I'm a bit curious how the wrong MEL was applied in the first place and wonder if I hadn't had them specifically check the autopilots what would have happened once airborne. It appears a divert would have been necessary. Maintenance seems to be getting a little sloppy lately. So now we are in cruise and driving along and after we coast out we notice we do not have SATCOM and that since we just left VHF coverage our CLDLC isn't working.1. There was no mention of this on the MEL. Can you consider adding it to MEL since the SATCOM antennae works off the ADIRU and it appears to be the left one.2. The new flight manual bulletin [is] a little cryptic. The HF data mode was working if we had it in data mode but the new SOP has us take it out of data mode. The language in bulletin says you can use it for company ACARS communication if SATCOM is ions but ought to elaborate on need for operational control obligations. Our ACARS messages were delayed by over 30 minutes between dispatch and us so I'm not sure how accurate the bulletin guidance was or is.3. The first officers were of the impression that Shanwick oceanic was sufficient for operational control purposes and I was 99% sure it was not. We debated if in fact it was necessary to patch to and LDOC (Long Distance Operations Control) (they had never heard that term and had no idea how to even do it. Not my first time hearing this in my fleet of late). Back and forth delayed messages with dispatch clearly established he couldn't reach us and he was attempting to SelCal us with NY LDOC at about the same time I was calling NY LDOC. This required one HF for ATC GP and one for LDOC. We made contact and advised of our problem with comms due to left ADIRU deferral and continued with LDOC for operational control. Spoke to Dispatch on ground and he mentioned it took him a long time to get a message to us from Shanwick and even then we didn't get it until after establishing contact with NY LDOC.Inbound to ZZZ I wrote up the SATCOM and ACARS being inoperative when out of VHF range due to the MEL deferral hoping the next crew wouldn't be surprised like we were. The MEL regarding this should expand on the limitations of not having SATCOM and mention the need to ensure operational control is maintained as it was clearly lost on this flight for some time.The fleet or standards needs to emphasize the need for operational control. I have noticed number of incumbent pilots who really don't understand who we are talking to and for what purposes nor the obligations for same.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.