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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 189499 |
Time | |
Date | 199109 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : pit |
State Reference | PA |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : pit |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Flight Phase | descent : approach descent other |
Route In Use | approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 180 flight time total : 30000 flight time type : 2000 |
ASRS Report | 189499 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | other |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
I believe this problem was caused by a policy of not providing personnel for conducting simultaneous ILS approachs when VMC conditions exist. I was XXX flight and I was not familiar with the area, and tired. There was an xxy flight on frequency and controllers were mixing us up and my copilot was unfamiliar with the area and for various reasons I wanted a structured ILS approach. The controller resisted my effort. 'Visuals are advertised, you're going to get a visual, you will be given a horrendous delay if you resist on an ILS'. Post-flight I talked on telephone to supervisor who said the controllers are trying to move as much traffic as possible, different procedures and extra personnel are required when simultaneous ILS's are in progress. My requesting an ILS makes it difficult for the approach facility and in the near future 30 percent more traffic is going to be going through pit. I told him I like visuals if conditions are comfortable, knowing the landmarks, i.e., 'tank', 'harbor freeway', shoe factory' are helpful in assuring the 'speck in the distance' is the aircraft you are separating from. Flying formation at night with other pilots, unfamiliar, perhaps foreign, side-by-side to 3 parallel runways is risky. My professional opinion is the facility policy ought to be to gracefully field a pilot wanting an ILS at any time regardless of how good the WX is. I called my company flight manager and he said he doesn't take visuals on the west coast at times because he is unfamiliar there. The company supports its pilots who sincerely feel an ILS is safer insisting on an ILS in those circumstances. I'm not faulting the controller.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: NO ANOMALY. RPTR PROTESTS NOT BEING AFFORDED FULL ILS WHEN VISUAL APCHS WERE BEING CONDUCTED.
Narrative: I BELIEVE THIS PROBLEM WAS CAUSED BY A POLICY OF NOT PROVIDING PERSONNEL FOR CONDUCTING SIMULTANEOUS ILS APCHS WHEN VMC CONDITIONS EXIST. I WAS XXX FLT AND I WAS NOT FAMILIAR WITH THE AREA, AND TIRED. THERE WAS AN XXY FLT ON FREQ AND CTLRS WERE MIXING US UP AND MY COPLT WAS UNFAMILIAR WITH THE AREA AND FOR VARIOUS REASONS I WANTED A STRUCTURED ILS APCH. THE CTLR RESISTED MY EFFORT. 'VISUALS ARE ADVERTISED, YOU'RE GOING TO GET A VISUAL, YOU WILL BE GIVEN A HORRENDOUS DELAY IF YOU RESIST ON AN ILS'. POST-FLT I TALKED ON TELEPHONE TO SUPVR WHO SAID THE CTLRS ARE TRYING TO MOVE AS MUCH TFC AS POSSIBLE, DIFFERENT PROCS AND EXTRA PERSONNEL ARE REQUIRED WHEN SIMULTANEOUS ILS'S ARE IN PROGRESS. MY REQUESTING AN ILS MAKES IT DIFFICULT FOR THE APCH FACILITY AND IN THE NEAR FUTURE 30 PERCENT MORE TFC IS GOING TO BE GOING THROUGH PIT. I TOLD HIM I LIKE VISUALS IF CONDITIONS ARE COMFORTABLE, KNOWING THE LANDMARKS, I.E., 'TANK', 'HARBOR FREEWAY', SHOE FACTORY' ARE HELPFUL IN ASSURING THE 'SPECK IN THE DISTANCE' IS THE ACFT YOU ARE SEPARATING FROM. FLYING FORMATION AT NIGHT WITH OTHER PLTS, UNFAMILIAR, PERHAPS FOREIGN, SIDE-BY-SIDE TO 3 PARALLEL RWYS IS RISKY. MY PROFESSIONAL OPINION IS THE FACILITY POLICY OUGHT TO BE TO GRACEFULLY FIELD A PLT WANTING AN ILS AT ANY TIME REGARDLESS OF HOW GOOD THE WX IS. I CALLED MY COMPANY FLT MGR AND HE SAID HE DOESN'T TAKE VISUALS ON THE W COAST AT TIMES BECAUSE HE IS UNFAMILIAR THERE. THE COMPANY SUPPORTS ITS PLTS WHO SINCERELY FEEL AN ILS IS SAFER INSISTING ON AN ILS IN THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES. I'M NOT FAULTING THE CTLR.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.