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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 210021 |
Time | |
Date | 199205 |
Day | Mon |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : phl |
State Reference | PA |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 3000 msl bound upper : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | Marginal |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : phl tower : mem |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Light Transport, High Wing, 2 Turboprop Eng |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 240 flight time total : 3400 flight time type : 1700 |
ASRS Report | 210021 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance flight crew : returned to intended course or assigned course |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
I was PF. Heading approximately south (180 degrees). Just past phl of our left. Lots of traffic for 9R and runway 35 (we are going to runway 35). Given the vector by philadelphia approach, 'air carrier turn left 030.' I thought this was a strange vector, because we didn't get a square base leg and I knew this was a tight vector to keep spacing on traffic behind us. The captain replied with 'air carrier-identify, left to 030.' no reply from the controller. I immediately brought this to the attention of the captain by stating something like 'that's a strange vector for where we are.' he responded with 'yeah.' he also pointed out traffic (on TCASII and visually) that we might be following. (Bad assumption). There was still 1 more aircraft ahead of us. I turned to 030. I questioned the captain again, and asked him to confirm our heading. After a brief discussion, he called on the radio and said something like, 'air carrier- identify has the field,' which I thought was rather ambiguous. That wasn't the question I would have asked. I don't believe the controller acknowledged. Now I was in a predicament of didn't want to go around' the captain, and get on the radio and say 'do you want air carrier-identification on a 030 heading?' it wasn't my job to handle the radios, and he might get annoyed. But it was looking more and more like the vector was incorrect. We were paralleling 2 airplanes off our right. And just before I made my radio call, I spotted an airplane on TCASII approaching from our 11 O'clock position and approximately 5-6 mi. The TCASII aircraft was the final straw, I called ATC and stated 'do you want air carrier-identify on a 030 heading?' he said no, go back to 180 degree. I immediately turned. The controller then asked if air carrier xy was on a 030 heading and they said no, they were never told to go to that heading. I think the biggest factor was the controller's incorrect vector to us. I don't think the captain helped by asking the wrong question. I believe he was trying to jog the memory of the controller and it didn't work.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: LTT ON VECTORS FOR APCH GIVEN WRONG VECTOR, MEANT FOR ANOTHER ACFT. QUESTIONS CTLR, GIVEN VECTOR BACK TO PREVIOUS HDG. TCASII VISUAL HELPED DETECT ERROR.
Narrative: I WAS PF. HDG APPROX S (180 DEGS). JUST PAST PHL OF OUR L. LOTS OF TFC FOR 9R AND RWY 35 (WE ARE GOING TO RWY 35). GIVEN THE VECTOR BY PHILADELPHIA APCH, 'ACR TURN L 030.' I THOUGHT THIS WAS A STRANGE VECTOR, BECAUSE WE DIDN'T GET A SQUARE BASE LEG AND I KNEW THIS WAS A TIGHT VECTOR TO KEEP SPACING ON TFC BEHIND US. THE CAPT REPLIED WITH 'ACR-IDENT, L TO 030.' NO REPLY FROM THE CTLR. I IMMEDIATELY BROUGHT THIS TO THE ATTN OF THE CAPT BY STATING SOMETHING LIKE 'THAT'S A STRANGE VECTOR FOR WHERE WE ARE.' HE RESPONDED WITH 'YEAH.' HE ALSO POINTED OUT TFC (ON TCASII AND VISUALLY) THAT WE MIGHT BE FOLLOWING. (BAD ASSUMPTION). THERE WAS STILL 1 MORE ACFT AHEAD OF US. I TURNED TO 030. I QUESTIONED THE CAPT AGAIN, AND ASKED HIM TO CONFIRM OUR HDG. AFTER A BRIEF DISCUSSION, HE CALLED ON THE RADIO AND SAID SOMETHING LIKE, 'ACR- IDENT HAS THE FIELD,' WHICH I THOUGHT WAS RATHER AMBIGUOUS. THAT WASN'T THE QUESTION I WOULD HAVE ASKED. I DON'T BELIEVE THE CTLR ACKNOWLEDGED. NOW I WAS IN A PREDICAMENT OF DIDN'T WANT TO GAR' THE CAPT, AND GET ON THE RADIO AND SAY 'DO YOU WANT ACR-ID ON A 030 HDG?' IT WASN'T MY JOB TO HANDLE THE RADIOS, AND HE MIGHT GET ANNOYED. BUT IT WAS LOOKING MORE AND MORE LIKE THE VECTOR WAS INCORRECT. WE WERE PARALLELING 2 AIRPLANES OFF OUR R. AND JUST BEFORE I MADE MY RADIO CALL, I SPOTTED AN AIRPLANE ON TCASII APCHING FROM OUR 11 O'CLOCK POS AND APPROX 5-6 MI. THE TCASII ACFT WAS THE FINAL STRAW, I CALLED ATC AND STATED 'DO YOU WANT ACR-IDENT ON A 030 HDG?' HE SAID NO, GO BACK TO 180 DEG. I IMMEDIATELY TURNED. THE CTLR THEN ASKED IF ACR XY WAS ON A 030 HDG AND THEY SAID NO, THEY WERE NEVER TOLD TO GO TO THAT HDG. I THINK THE BIGGEST FACTOR WAS THE CTLR'S INCORRECT VECTOR TO US. I DON'T THINK THE CAPT HELPED BY ASKING THE WRONG QUESTION. I BELIEVE HE WAS TRYING TO JOG THE MEMORY OF THE CTLR AND IT DIDN'T WORK.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.