37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 283100 |
Time | |
Date | 199409 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : cdg |
State Reference | FO |
Altitude | agl bound lower : 0 agl bound upper : 0 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B727 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | ground other : taxi |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Airbus Industrie Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | ground other : taxi |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 80 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 3000 |
ASRS Report | 283100 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : flight engineer pilot : cfi pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 120 flight time total : 4500 flight time type : 1500 |
ASRS Report | 283019 |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : clearance other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Airport |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Situations | |
Airport | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
Flight was taxiing from the cargo ramp gate to runway 27. The taxi clearance received from cdg ground was 'taxi holding point 27.' while on taxiway N12 approaching kilo loop the crew observed an air carrier aircraft entering the kilo loop via N20.1. Our aircraft appeared to be well ahead of the airbus and continued via the bypass to N-13 taxiway en route to runway 27. The airbus then on the kilo loop had a conversation in french with the ground controller. The ground controller then said in english to our flight 'you should have given way to the airbus on the 'uncontrolled' kilo loop.' our aircraft never entered the kilo loop and was under the impression all of cdg airport was controled. We apologized and continued an uneventful flight. If the actions of our aircraft were incorrect, and at this point, I'm not sure they were, the commercial chart to cdg should have remarks stating the txwys are 'uncontrolled.' we, as all united states carriers, assume a clearance to taxi has no restrictions if not crossing an active runway. The cdg ground controllers should also give 'give way' instructions when a potential conflict exists. Supplemental information from acn 283019: the airbus crew complained to ground that we had not given him right of way. Ground then explained to us that aircraft on the K loop had right of way. This did not occur on the K loop, but we apologized anyway and stated that we did not know about that rule. This could have been avoided if ground had just told us to give way to the aircraft approaching from the south.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: AIR CARGO ACFT IS ACCUSED OF FAILING TO GIVE WAY TO SECOND ACFT ON LOOP TXWY.
Narrative: FLT WAS TAXIING FROM THE CARGO RAMP GATE TO RWY 27. THE TAXI CLRNC RECEIVED FROM CDG GND WAS 'TAXI HOLDING POINT 27.' WHILE ON TXWY N12 APCHING KILO LOOP THE CREW OBSERVED AN ACR ACFT ENTERING THE KILO LOOP VIA N20.1. OUR ACFT APPEARED TO BE WELL AHEAD OF THE AIRBUS AND CONTINUED VIA THE BYPASS TO N-13 TXWY ENRTE TO RWY 27. THE AIRBUS THEN ON THE KILO LOOP HAD A CONVERSATION IN FRENCH WITH THE GND CTLR. THE GND CTLR THEN SAID IN ENGLISH TO OUR FLT 'YOU SHOULD HAVE GIVEN WAY TO THE AIRBUS ON THE 'UNCTLED' KILO LOOP.' OUR ACFT NEVER ENTERED THE KILO LOOP AND WAS UNDER THE IMPRESSION ALL OF CDG ARPT WAS CTLED. WE APOLOGIZED AND CONTINUED AN UNEVENTFUL FLT. IF THE ACTIONS OF OUR ACFT WERE INCORRECT, AND AT THIS POINT, I'M NOT SURE THEY WERE, THE COMMERCIAL CHART TO CDG SHOULD HAVE REMARKS STATING THE TXWYS ARE 'UNCTLED.' WE, AS ALL UNITED STATES CARRIERS, ASSUME A CLRNC TO TAXI HAS NO RESTRICTIONS IF NOT XING AN ACTIVE RWY. THE CDG GND CTLRS SHOULD ALSO GIVE 'GIVE WAY' INSTRUCTIONS WHEN A POTENTIAL CONFLICT EXISTS. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 283019: THE AIRBUS CREW COMPLAINED TO GND THAT WE HAD NOT GIVEN HIM RIGHT OF WAY. GND THEN EXPLAINED TO US THAT ACFT ON THE K LOOP HAD RIGHT OF WAY. THIS DID NOT OCCUR ON THE K LOOP, BUT WE APOLOGIZED ANYWAY AND STATED THAT WE DID NOT KNOW ABOUT THAT RULE. THIS COULD HAVE BEEN AVOIDED IF GND HAD JUST TOLD US TO GIVE WAY TO THE ACFT APCHING FROM THE S.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.