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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 284529 |
Time | |
Date | 199409 |
Day | Mon |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : tpa |
State Reference | FL |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 3000 msl bound upper : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : tpa |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | cruise other |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | MD-81 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | cruise other |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 220 flight time total : 6800 flight time type : 3800 |
ASRS Report | 284529 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : commercial |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : excursion from assigned altitude conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : clearance non adherence : published procedure non adherence : required legal separation |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other controllera |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance flight crew : took evasive action other |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 3000 vertical : 100 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation Operational Error |
Narrative:
Air carrier X inbound to tpa from the (captain flying) we heard tpa approach and an air carrier Y md-80 arguing. It seemed that Y was deviating around some thunderstorms at 3000 ft and had not told ATC of such heading changes. ATC was not pleased with this and asked Y what he was doing in a somewhat hostile comment. I guess Y did not like ATC's attitude about the situation and so they kept saying comments to each other. They then got in to it about the altitude that Y was supposed to be at. ATC said 4000 ft and Y said 3000 ft. While all this was going on, we were cruising eastbound on radar vectors for runway 18R in tpa (level at 3000 ft) at about 3-4 mins into ATC's and Y's verbal fight over the air, ATC must have realized that this situation was getting out of hand because he now had us heading east at 3000 ft and Y heading northwest at 3000 ft on converging courses. ATC then pointed traffic to us and put us on a 330 heading. We got visual on Y as we started the turn, I (flying the aircraft) lost sight of the md-80 under the right side of the nose as I banked away from them. At this point, ATC again told that he was supposed to be at 4000 ft. While we were in the turn my first officer said that the md-80 was still heading for us. At this point, I thought of several things that I could do: 1) roll wings level to keep visual on the md-80. 2) climb. 3) descend, or 4) keep turning to the northwest. I chose to keep turning. If I had rolled wings level, I would have put us closer. I did not want to climb or descend because he might have done the same. As it turned out, he descended under. Also, we had TCASII on board and all it said was traffic -- no RA! It was obvious that this was the cause of the argument and neither Y or ATC was doing what they were supposed to be doing (flying or separating traffic). Y was at the wrong altitude and ATC allowed us to get too close.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACR X HAD LTSS FROM ACR Y AT WRONG ALT. SYS ERROR PLTDEV.
Narrative: ACR X INBOUND TO TPA FROM THE (CAPT FLYING) WE HEARD TPA APCH AND AN ACR Y MD-80 ARGUING. IT SEEMED THAT Y WAS DEVIATING AROUND SOME TSTMS AT 3000 FT AND HAD NOT TOLD ATC OF SUCH HDG CHANGES. ATC WAS NOT PLEASED WITH THIS AND ASKED Y WHAT HE WAS DOING IN A SOMEWHAT HOSTILE COMMENT. I GUESS Y DID NOT LIKE ATC'S ATTITUDE ABOUT THE SIT AND SO THEY KEPT SAYING COMMENTS TO EACH OTHER. THEY THEN GOT IN TO IT ABOUT THE ALT THAT Y WAS SUPPOSED TO BE AT. ATC SAID 4000 FT AND Y SAID 3000 FT. WHILE ALL THIS WAS GOING ON, WE WERE CRUISING EBOUND ON RADAR VECTORS FOR RWY 18R IN TPA (LEVEL AT 3000 FT) AT ABOUT 3-4 MINS INTO ATC'S AND Y'S VERBAL FIGHT OVER THE AIR, ATC MUST HAVE REALIZED THAT THIS SIT WAS GETTING OUT OF HAND BECAUSE HE NOW HAD US HDG E AT 3000 FT AND Y HDG NW AT 3000 FT ON CONVERGING COURSES. ATC THEN POINTED TFC TO US AND PUT US ON A 330 HDG. WE GOT VISUAL ON Y AS WE STARTED THE TURN, I (FLYING THE ACFT) LOST SIGHT OF THE MD-80 UNDER THE R SIDE OF THE NOSE AS I BANKED AWAY FROM THEM. AT THIS POINT, ATC AGAIN TOLD THAT HE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE AT 4000 FT. WHILE WE WERE IN THE TURN MY FO SAID THAT THE MD-80 WAS STILL HDG FOR US. AT THIS POINT, I THOUGHT OF SEVERAL THINGS THAT I COULD DO: 1) ROLL WINGS LEVEL TO KEEP VISUAL ON THE MD-80. 2) CLB. 3) DSND, OR 4) KEEP TURNING TO THE NW. I CHOSE TO KEEP TURNING. IF I HAD ROLLED WINGS LEVEL, I WOULD HAVE PUT US CLOSER. I DID NOT WANT TO CLB OR DSND BECAUSE HE MIGHT HAVE DONE THE SAME. AS IT TURNED OUT, HE DSNDED UNDER. ALSO, WE HAD TCASII ON BOARD AND ALL IT SAID WAS TFC -- NO RA! IT WAS OBVIOUS THAT THIS WAS THE CAUSE OF THE ARGUMENT AND NEITHER Y OR ATC WAS DOING WHAT THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO BE DOING (FLYING OR SEPARATING TFC). Y WAS AT THE WRONG ALT AND ATC ALLOWED US TO GET TOO CLOSE.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.