37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 287537 |
Time | |
Date | 199411 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : cvg |
State Reference | OH |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 4800 msl bound upper : 4800 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Dusk |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : cvg artcc : zhu |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach descent other |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Make Model Name | Any Unknown or Unlisted Aircraft Manufacturer |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 70 flight time total : 9000 flight time type : 1800 |
ASRS Report | 287537 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : instrument |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : clearance |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : took evasive action |
Consequence | faa : investigated |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 500 vertical : 1200 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Air carrier X on descent into cvg we were assigned runway 18L. Descending out of 9000 ft were told to level at 6000 ft and assigned runway 18R. Descent was then given to 3500 ft and a short turn in to the marker for runway 18R (approximately 4 mi outside of OM and 4000 ft) above marker altitude we were asked if we had visual with runway 18R. We told approach we would not accept a visual and told to level at 4000 ft. A left turn was initiated to assigned heading of 290 degree (we were heading east). This turned us into the oncoming approach traffic for runway 18R. We questioned the altitude seeing aircraft on TCASII approaching below us. ATC then asked us to confirm level 5000 ft we took the aircraft off of autoplt and a climb was initiated from 4800 ft. At that time a TCASII climb RA was heard. We did have a visual with the other aircraft and came within 1200 ft vertical separation on TCASII. Corrective action: ATC needs to realize airplanes do not descend like elevators and keeping them unrealistically high then telling them to take visual approachs is unacceptable. I refuse to do it. It is unnecessary, unsafe, and extremely uncomfortable for the passenger.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACR X REFUSED CLRNC VISUAL APCH HAD TCASII RA WITH INBOUND TFC TO PARALLEL RWY.
Narrative: ACR X ON DSCNT INTO CVG WE WERE ASSIGNED RWY 18L. DSNDING OUT OF 9000 FT WERE TOLD TO LEVEL AT 6000 FT AND ASSIGNED RWY 18R. DSCNT WAS THEN GIVEN TO 3500 FT AND A SHORT TURN IN TO THE MARKER FOR RWY 18R (APPROX 4 MI OUTSIDE OF OM AND 4000 FT) ABOVE MARKER ALT WE WERE ASKED IF WE HAD VISUAL WITH RWY 18R. WE TOLD APCH WE WOULD NOT ACCEPT A VISUAL AND TOLD TO LEVEL AT 4000 FT. A L TURN WAS INITIATED TO ASSIGNED HDG OF 290 DEG (WE WERE HEADING E). THIS TURNED US INTO THE ONCOMING APCH TFC FOR RWY 18R. WE QUESTIONED THE ALT SEEING ACFT ON TCASII APCHING BELOW US. ATC THEN ASKED US TO CONFIRM LEVEL 5000 FT WE TOOK THE ACFT OFF OF AUTOPLT AND A CLB WAS INITIATED FROM 4800 FT. AT THAT TIME A TCASII CLB RA WAS HEARD. WE DID HAVE A VISUAL WITH THE OTHER ACFT AND CAME WITHIN 1200 FT VERT SEPARATION ON TCASII. CORRECTIVE ACTION: ATC NEEDS TO REALIZE AIRPLANES DO NOT DSND LIKE ELEVATORS AND KEEPING THEM UNREALISTICALLY HIGH THEN TELLING THEM TO TAKE VISUAL APCHS IS UNACCEPTABLE. I REFUSE TO DO IT. IT IS UNNECESSARY, UNSAFE, AND EXTREMELY UNCOMFORTABLE FOR THE PAX.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.