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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 288439 |
Time | |
Date | 199411 |
Day | Tue |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : fmg |
State Reference | NV |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 16500 msl bound upper : 19000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | Mixed |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zoa |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | descent other |
Route In Use | enroute : direct enroute airway : zoa |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | other |
Make Model Name | Hornet (F-18) |
Operating Under FAR Part | other : other |
Flight Phase | cruise other |
Route In Use | enroute : direct |
Flight Plan | VFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 2000 |
ASRS Report | 288439 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 235 flight time total : 14000 flight time type : 2700 |
ASRS Report | 288614 |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : undershoot conflict : nmac non adherence : clearance |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : took evasive action |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 0 vertical : 150 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Narrative:
Air carrier X had been cleared by ZOA to descend and maintain 16000 ft. At approximately 17100 ft we received a TCASII TA showing 2 targets 12:30-1 O'clock position, opposite direction and below. Vertical and horizontal distance was closing rapidly, and within seconds we received a TCASII RA, 'climb climb' both of us reacted immediately, disconnecting the autoplt, advancing the throttles, and aggressively initiating a climb. At that time I noted the target merging with our own aircraft symbol on the navigation display and showing 'minus 100 ft.' we were approximately 16500 ft at the bottom, and we topped out of the maneuver at about 19000 ft: I called center to report the RA and the climb, and the controller said 'I don't show any traffic in your vicinity.' the first officer said ATC had 'found' a couple of flight attendant 18's in our area, VFR at 16500 ft. After landing pair of GA pilots approached the flight deck, wanting to know if the abrupt climb 'had anything to do with those F-14's we saw out the window.' I replied in the affirmative. It would be easy to confuse an F-18 with an F-14 under the circumstances. WX was broken clouds, scattered snow showers and continuous light to moderate turbulence over rugged terrain -- very difficult conditions for spotting 2 fighters. My guess is that the F-18 jocks forgot we had TCASII and were very surprised when we reacted to their presence. (That, or they simply didn't see us until too late.) I recommend that military pilots confine their training to MOA's and other military aircraft and leave the air carriers out of it. We were lucky this time. At the very least we could have injured someone in back during the pull up. Fortunately it didn't happen. Supplemental information from acn 288614: 20 mi southeast fmg VOR during IFR descent to 16000 ft under ZOA control we received a TCASII warning. It was on the nose at about 12 mi. I switched to 10 mi range and followed the indication down to 3 mi still on the nose when we received the climb command. I disconnected the autoplt pushed thrust levers forward and pulled back on stick. We asked ZOA about traffic and they said they didn't have any. We told them of our evasive climb then they called back and said they now have an F-18 behind us opposite direction at 16500 ft VFR.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACR X TCASII RA HAD NMAC WITH 2 FA 18 S. EVASIVE ACTION CLB. SEE AND AVOID CONCEPT.
Narrative: ACR X HAD BEEN CLRED BY ZOA TO DSND AND MAINTAIN 16000 FT. AT APPROX 17100 FT WE RECEIVED A TCASII TA SHOWING 2 TARGETS 12:30-1 O'CLOCK POS, OPPOSITE DIRECTION AND BELOW. VERT AND HORIZ DISTANCE WAS CLOSING RAPIDLY, AND WITHIN SECONDS WE RECEIVED A TCASII RA, 'CLB CLB' BOTH OF US REACTED IMMEDIATELY, DISCONNECTING THE AUTOPLT, ADVANCING THE THROTTLES, AND AGGRESSIVELY INITIATING A CLB. AT THAT TIME I NOTED THE TARGET MERGING WITH OUR OWN ACFT SYMBOL ON THE NAV DISPLAY AND SHOWING 'MINUS 100 FT.' WE WERE APPROX 16500 FT AT THE BOTTOM, AND WE TOPPED OUT OF THE MANEUVER AT ABOUT 19000 FT: I CALLED CTR TO RPT THE RA AND THE CLB, AND THE CTLR SAID 'I DON'T SHOW ANY TFC IN YOUR VICINITY.' THE FO SAID ATC HAD 'FOUND' A COUPLE OF FA 18'S IN OUR AREA, VFR AT 16500 FT. AFTER LNDG PAIR OF GA PLTS APCHED THE FLT DECK, WANTING TO KNOW IF THE ABRUPT CLB 'HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH THOSE F-14'S WE SAW OUT THE WINDOW.' I REPLIED IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. IT WOULD BE EASY TO CONFUSE AN F-18 WITH AN F-14 UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCES. WX WAS BROKEN CLOUDS, SCATTERED SNOW SHOWERS AND CONTINUOUS LIGHT TO MODERATE TURB OVER RUGGED TERRAIN -- VERY DIFFICULT CONDITIONS FOR SPOTTING 2 FIGHTERS. MY GUESS IS THAT THE F-18 JOCKS FORGOT WE HAD TCASII AND WERE VERY SURPRISED WHEN WE REACTED TO THEIR PRESENCE. (THAT, OR THEY SIMPLY DIDN'T SEE US UNTIL TOO LATE.) I RECOMMEND THAT MIL PLTS CONFINE THEIR TRAINING TO MOA'S AND OTHER MIL ACFT AND LEAVE THE AIR CARRIERS OUT OF IT. WE WERE LUCKY THIS TIME. AT THE VERY LEAST WE COULD HAVE INJURED SOMEONE IN BACK DURING THE PULL UP. FORTUNATELY IT DIDN'T HAPPEN. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 288614: 20 MI SE FMG VOR DURING IFR DSCNT TO 16000 FT UNDER ZOA CTL WE RECEIVED A TCASII WARNING. IT WAS ON THE NOSE AT ABOUT 12 MI. I SWITCHED TO 10 MI RANGE AND FOLLOWED THE INDICATION DOWN TO 3 MI STILL ON THE NOSE WHEN WE RECEIVED THE CLB COMMAND. I DISCONNECTED THE AUTOPLT PUSHED THRUST LEVERS FORWARD AND PULLED BACK ON STICK. WE ASKED ZOA ABOUT TFC AND THEY SAID THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANY. WE TOLD THEM OF OUR EVASIVE CLB THEN THEY CALLED BACK AND SAID THEY NOW HAVE AN F-18 BEHIND US OPPOSITE DIRECTION AT 16500 FT VFR.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.