Flight crew were unprepared for DME arc ILS approach. Reporter claimed no time to look at approach p...

Attributes
ACN	334210
Time
Date	199604
Day	Tue
Local Time Of Day	1801 To 2400
Place
Locale Reference	atc facility : mqg airport : lws
State Reference	ID
Altitude	msl bound lower : 5300 msl bound upper : 6000
Environment
Flight Conditions	IMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	artcc : zse
Operator	common carrier : air taxi
Make Model Name	Any Unknown or Unlisted Aircraft Manufacturer
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 135
Flight Phase	cruise other descent : approach descent other
Route In Use	enroute : direct enroute : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air taxi
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 75 flight time total : 24000 flight time type : 700
ASRS Report	334210
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air taxi
Function	flight crew : first officer
Qualification	pilot : instrument pilot : commercial
Events
Anomaly	non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	controller : issued new clearance
Consequence	Other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	Flight Crew Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	Pilot Deviation

Narrative:

We were en route from coe to lws. The route was filed radar vector direct to lws. A few mi north of lws (30 or 40 mi) we were given a hold clearance at mqg VOR. While descending we figured out how to do that. Then when we were approximately 10 mi from mqg, maybe even less, we were cleared for a DME arc approach to intercept the runway 26 ILS and to descend to 6000 ft. There was no time to look at the approach plate that close in -- at 200 KTS. Then we were given a frequency change and could not raise anyone. I told the copilot to try the tower. We flew to the VOR and continued on through the localizer, which is only 1 or 2 mi from the VOR. I turned back to the VOR to try the whole thing over, then climbed to 8000 ft because of the mountains. We started out of the VOR on a northeast heading. The DME was intermittent, so I asked for a vector. The controller informed me that it was impossible because of the altitude. I found out later that had we been at 10000 ft, the radar controller could have given us a vector to intercept the localizer very easily. We would have no trouble getting down in time. Since I kept insisting, they finally gave us a vector to the airport. He said I would probably break out at 6000 ft. We did, and landed. There is nothing on the approach plate that says anything about the radar. I frankly do not understand why we can be on radar at 6000 ft and cannot be vectored 'because of the altitude.' it seems like if it's safe for me to be there, it should be safe for the controller to give me vectors. There must be something that I have no way of knowing about. Radar controller's rules or something. The controller supervisor at spokane FSDO told me they have had trouble with DME arc approachs before. If I had known what to expect, say 50 mi out, there would not have been a problem. It is not too complicated.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: FLC WERE UNPREPARED FOR DME ARC ILS APCH. RPTR CLAIMED NO TIME TO LOOK AT APCH PLATE WITH REF TO BEING THAT CLOSE IN. ACFT WENT THROUGH THE LOC AND TO THE VOR. FLC CLBED TO 8000 FT DUE TO TERRAIN AND PLANNED TO REDO THE APCH. ANOTHER ILS WAS NOT ATTEMPTED. THE CTLR GAVE THE ACFT A VECTOR TO THE ARPT.

Narrative: WE WERE ENRTE FROM COE TO LWS. THE RTE WAS FILED RADAR VECTOR DIRECT TO LWS. A FEW MI N OF LWS (30 OR 40 MI) WE WERE GIVEN A HOLD CLRNC AT MQG VOR. WHILE DSNDING WE FIGURED OUT HOW TO DO THAT. THEN WHEN WE WERE APPROX 10 MI FROM MQG, MAYBE EVEN LESS, WE WERE CLRED FOR A DME ARC APCH TO INTERCEPT THE RWY 26 ILS AND TO DSND TO 6000 FT. THERE WAS NO TIME TO LOOK AT THE APCH PLATE THAT CLOSE IN -- AT 200 KTS. THEN WE WERE GIVEN A FREQ CHANGE AND COULD NOT RAISE ANYONE. I TOLD THE COPLT TO TRY THE TWR. WE FLEW TO THE VOR AND CONTINUED ON THROUGH THE LOC, WHICH IS ONLY 1 OR 2 MI FROM THE VOR. I TURNED BACK TO THE VOR TO TRY THE WHOLE THING OVER, THEN CLBED TO 8000 FT BECAUSE OF THE MOUNTAINS. WE STARTED OUT OF THE VOR ON A NE HDG. THE DME WAS INTERMITTENT, SO I ASKED FOR A VECTOR. THE CTLR INFORMED ME THAT IT WAS IMPOSSIBLE BECAUSE OF THE ALT. I FOUND OUT LATER THAT HAD WE BEEN AT 10000 FT, THE RADAR CTLR COULD HAVE GIVEN US A VECTOR TO INTERCEPT THE LOC VERY EASILY. WE WOULD HAVE NO TROUBLE GETTING DOWN IN TIME. SINCE I KEPT INSISTING, THEY FINALLY GAVE US A VECTOR TO THE ARPT. HE SAID I WOULD PROBABLY BREAK OUT AT 6000 FT. WE DID, AND LANDED. THERE IS NOTHING ON THE APCH PLATE THAT SAYS ANYTHING ABOUT THE RADAR. I FRANKLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE CAN BE ON RADAR AT 6000 FT AND CANNOT BE VECTORED 'BECAUSE OF THE ALT.' IT SEEMS LIKE IF IT'S SAFE FOR ME TO BE THERE, IT SHOULD BE SAFE FOR THE CTLR TO GIVE ME VECTORS. THERE MUST BE SOMETHING THAT I HAVE NO WAY OF KNOWING ABOUT. RADAR CTLR'S RULES OR SOMETHING. THE CTLR SUPVR AT SPOKANE FSDO TOLD ME THEY HAVE HAD TROUBLE WITH DME ARC APCHS BEFORE. IF I HAD KNOWN WHAT TO EXPECT, SAY 50 MI OUT, THERE WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN A PROB. IT IS NOT TOO COMPLICATED.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.