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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 350353 |
Time | |
Date | 199610 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : lax |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 1000 msl bound upper : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : lax tower : elp |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | climbout : intermediate altitude |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | MD-80 Series (DC-9-80) Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | climbout : intermediate altitude |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : flight engineer pilot : commercial pilot : cfi pilot : instrument pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 210 flight time total : 10100 flight time type : 3800 |
ASRS Report | 350353 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : instrument |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : clearance non adherence other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : took evasive action |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 1000 vertical : 1000 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
We were cleared for takeoff on runway 24L heading 250 degrees, maintain visual separation with MD80 rolling on runway 24R. Tower's instructions included, 'he's turning northbound.' believing the MD80 would be turning to the north just after takeoff, we began our takeoff roll. We were behind MD80 as we started our takeoff, but when we became airborne we began to overtake them. The MD80 had not turned and continued to parallel our course, trailing 1000 ft behind us. I informed the tower of this but got no response. MD80 transmitted to us that they had us in sight. I became concerned about the continued safety of this operation so we leveled off at 2000 ft (we were cleared to 3000 ft). The MD80 had climbed to 3000 ft, and was still paralleling our course. The MD80 requested a turn to the right and was finally given one by departure. We reported level at 2000 ft to departure and when we saw MD80 finally begin turning away, began climbing to our newly assigned altitude of 13000 ft. ATC provided no help to either aircraft despite repeated calls due to frequency congestion in an extremely busy terminal environment. We have grown so used to operating in close proximity to other aircraft on parallel runways, particularly on runways 1 in sfo that we can be lulled into accepting a poorly planned clearance such as this one. Had I known that the other aircraft was in fact not going to turn away just after liftoff as I had been led to believe, I would never have accepted that clearance. It must be remembered any time visual separation is accepted pilots must have an out to maintain control of the situation if it doesn't work out as expected.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: CONFLICT OCCURS WHEN MLG IS TOLD TO MAINTAIN VISUAL SEPARATION FROM AN MD80 ON DEP FROM LAX.
Narrative: WE WERE CLRED FOR TKOF ON RWY 24L HDG 250 DEGS, MAINTAIN VISUAL SEPARATION WITH MD80 ROLLING ON RWY 24R. TWR'S INSTRUCTIONS INCLUDED, 'HE'S TURNING NBOUND.' BELIEVING THE MD80 WOULD BE TURNING TO THE N JUST AFTER TKOF, WE BEGAN OUR TKOF ROLL. WE WERE BEHIND MD80 AS WE STARTED OUR TKOF, BUT WHEN WE BECAME AIRBORNE WE BEGAN TO OVERTAKE THEM. THE MD80 HAD NOT TURNED AND CONTINUED TO PARALLEL OUR COURSE, TRAILING 1000 FT BEHIND US. I INFORMED THE TWR OF THIS BUT GOT NO RESPONSE. MD80 XMITTED TO US THAT THEY HAD US IN SIGHT. I BECAME CONCERNED ABOUT THE CONTINUED SAFETY OF THIS OP SO WE LEVELED OFF AT 2000 FT (WE WERE CLRED TO 3000 FT). THE MD80 HAD CLBED TO 3000 FT, AND WAS STILL PARALLELING OUR COURSE. THE MD80 REQUESTED A TURN TO THE R AND WAS FINALLY GIVEN ONE BY DEP. WE RPTED LEVEL AT 2000 FT TO DEP AND WHEN WE SAW MD80 FINALLY BEGIN TURNING AWAY, BEGAN CLBING TO OUR NEWLY ASSIGNED ALT OF 13000 FT. ATC PROVIDED NO HELP TO EITHER ACFT DESPITE REPEATED CALLS DUE TO FREQ CONGESTION IN AN EXTREMELY BUSY TERMINAL ENVIRONMENT. WE HAVE GROWN SO USED TO OPERATING IN CLOSE PROX TO OTHER ACFT ON PARALLEL RWYS, PARTICULARLY ON RWYS 1 IN SFO THAT WE CAN BE LULLED INTO ACCEPTING A POORLY PLANNED CLRNC SUCH AS THIS ONE. HAD I KNOWN THAT THE OTHER ACFT WAS IN FACT NOT GOING TO TURN AWAY JUST AFTER LIFTOFF AS I HAD BEEN LED TO BELIEVE, I WOULD NEVER HAVE ACCEPTED THAT CLRNC. IT MUST BE REMEMBERED ANY TIME VISUAL SEPARATION IS ACCEPTED PLTS MUST HAVE AN OUT TO MAINTAIN CTL OF THE SIT IF IT DOESN'T WORK OUT AS EXPECTED.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.