37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 370563 |
Time | |
Date | 199706 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : cgt |
State Reference | IL |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 11500 msl bound upper : 11500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : ord artcc : zid |
Operator | general aviation : personal |
Make Model Name | Any Unknown or Unlisted Aircraft Manufacturer |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Flight Phase | cruise other |
Route In Use | enroute : direct |
Aircraft 2 | |
Make Model Name | B737 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | Other |
Function | flight crew : single pilot |
Qualification | pilot : flight engineer pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : cfi pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 260 flight time total : 8000 flight time type : 400 |
ASRS Report | 370563 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 200 vertical : 500 |
Supplementary | |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
I departed from runway 10C on northwest side of ord class B, VFR, headed to cvg. I climbed on 090 degree heading clear of class B to 10500 ft then turned southeast on course while climbing to 11500 ft VFR using current ord altimeter. I was monitoring ord approach control but had not established contact. The top of ord class B is 10000 ft MSL. About 15 NM southeast of cgt VOR, I observed an air carrier X B737 pass 500 ft below me inbound to ord and heard ATC and air carrier X discussing the traffic, me. While, I believe, everyone was legal, the possibilities do exist for a close call or a TCASII RA. The problem stems from the inflexibility of ord ATC. If an IFR aircraft (small) had an IFR flight plan even in VFR conditions, that aircraft would be held down to 3000 ft and issued a very lengthy routing around either side of class B, not allowed to climb until about 50 NM south of lake michigan. In view of this, many pilots opt to fly over the top of class B at appropriate VFR cruising altitudes, legal, but often in the face of oncoming airliner traffic. Previous attempts to obtain VFR flight following have been met with inconsistent results as have attempts to obtain a more direct routing that is acceptable to ATC and the light aircraft pilot. The airliners do not own the airways but it is often conveyed as such through actions of ATC. I believe there needs to be more integration/consideration of small aircraft by ord ATC so we have a well-defined plan, corridor, or routing and altitude possibilities.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: GA SMA DEPARTED VFR AND CLBED TO 11500 FT CLR OF THE CLASS B AIRSPACE. SAW A B737 INBOUND TO ORD 500 FT BELOW. OVERHEARD ATC AND B737 DISCUSSING THE TFC. NO EVASIVE ACTION TAKEN BUT RPTR FEELS ALTS OR RTES SHOULD BE AVAILABLE TO GA ACFT SO THEY COULD OPERATE WITH CTLR.
Narrative: I DEPARTED FROM RWY 10C ON NW SIDE OF ORD CLASS B, VFR, HEADED TO CVG. I CLBED ON 090 DEG HDG CLR OF CLASS B TO 10500 FT THEN TURNED SE ON COURSE WHILE CLBING TO 11500 FT VFR USING CURRENT ORD ALTIMETER. I WAS MONITORING ORD APCH CTL BUT HAD NOT ESTABLISHED CONTACT. THE TOP OF ORD CLASS B IS 10000 FT MSL. ABOUT 15 NM SE OF CGT VOR, I OBSERVED AN ACR X B737 PASS 500 FT BELOW ME INBOUND TO ORD AND HEARD ATC AND ACR X DISCUSSING THE TFC, ME. WHILE, I BELIEVE, EVERYONE WAS LEGAL, THE POSSIBILITIES DO EXIST FOR A CLOSE CALL OR A TCASII RA. THE PROB STEMS FROM THE INFLEXIBILITY OF ORD ATC. IF AN IFR ACFT (SMALL) HAD AN IFR FLT PLAN EVEN IN VFR CONDITIONS, THAT ACFT WOULD BE HELD DOWN TO 3000 FT AND ISSUED A VERY LENGTHY ROUTING AROUND EITHER SIDE OF CLASS B, NOT ALLOWED TO CLB UNTIL ABOUT 50 NM S OF LAKE MICHIGAN. IN VIEW OF THIS, MANY PLTS OPT TO FLY OVER THE TOP OF CLASS B AT APPROPRIATE VFR CRUISING ALTS, LEGAL, BUT OFTEN IN THE FACE OF ONCOMING AIRLINER TFC. PREVIOUS ATTEMPTS TO OBTAIN VFR FLT FOLLOWING HAVE BEEN MET WITH INCONSISTENT RESULTS AS HAVE ATTEMPTS TO OBTAIN A MORE DIRECT ROUTING THAT IS ACCEPTABLE TO ATC AND THE LIGHT ACFT PLT. THE AIRLINERS DO NOT OWN THE AIRWAYS BUT IT IS OFTEN CONVEYED AS SUCH THROUGH ACTIONS OF ATC. I BELIEVE THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE INTEGRATION/CONSIDERATION OF SMALL ACFT BY ORD ATC SO WE HAVE A WELL-DEFINED PLAN, CORRIDOR, OR ROUTING AND ALT POSSIBILITIES.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.